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NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

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Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#231

Post by conanbatt »

NoblePublius wrote: post #138
chiefalchemist wrote: post #131

Let's be clear, the free market this is not. It's yet another perfect example of government gone wild. It's one thing for to use taxpayer monies to create jobs and job opportunity (i.e., education). That's a reasonable expectation within the scope of gov's governing. However, it's another thing for gov to buy jobs - and thus votes - by effectively subsidizing some mega-corporation. If Amazon needs money, that's what…

Literally the opposite. The tax gains out number the tax breaks 3 to 1. Each one of these $150k jobs will net NY state $13.8k of income tax per year and (at least) $2500 of sales tax. The tax break per job is $4800 per year (the $48k figure you may have seen is over ten years).

The tax gains would always outnumber the tax cost for any business, which is why the city government is favoring corporate over small business, that employ way more people for a lot less monopoly rents.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#232

Post by Apocryphon »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #227
Apocryphon wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the best way to gauge the support/opposition was to put this deal into a city-wide referendum to begin with.

How'd that work out in the case of Brexit? Direct democracy is not really the best way to govern.

The distance of separation between a New Yorker and the city government is magnitudes closer than between a Briton and the EU agencies.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#233

Post by kodablah »

gorbachev wrote: post #229
vdnkh wrote: post #32

1) Incentives are not given up front. They are given proportional to the results Amazon has achieved. Amazon must make a report each year detailing their progress before any award is given. 2) The city-level incentives are available to any business. State-level incentives (I think 300m) are not. 3) Amazon has pledged to invest in the local community as part of the deal. There are plans for an elementary school and te…

"Please tell me what about this is bad." A trillion dollar company does not need subsidies.

It does if you want their business. You made a statement, you didn't say why it was bad.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#234

Post by WalterBright »

zjaffee wrote: post #206
fmmow wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech hasn't been kind to Seattle or SF. Maybe to the people attracted likely to be filling this jobs, but not to the people in the surrounding areas. LIC was mostly warehouses at one point and you're right a lot of the new units are housing for people moving away from Manhattan. But the concern is not just about LIC; it's about Corona, Astoria, Jackson Heights. These are areas with a lot of immigrant communities, com…

Tech might not have been kind to the cities of SF and Seattle sure, but tech built the greater metropolitan regions of both of these areas, where Seattle metro's population has doubled as a result of the tech boom since 1980, and the bay area's population has grown by ~70% in the same time frame, for reference, this isn't that far off from the nominal growth seen in greater Los Angeles during the same period.

Seattle was created to supply the Yukon gold rush miners. Then it was heavily dependent on Weyerhauser (lumber). Then it was Boeing (will the last person who leaves Seattle please turn out the lights.) Now tech.

Seattle's always been a one horse economy.

(Something like 15% of workers in Seattle are Amazonians.)

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#235

Post by hnmonkey »

kodablah wrote: post #233
gorbachev wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Please tell me what about this is bad." A trillion dollar company does not need subsidies.

It does if you want their business. You made a statement, you didn't say why it was bad.

You know, I was going to respond to you by saying that there will always be Amazon business without a new HQ in a place. However, I thought about it and it is certainly possible that they would test new and interesting things in markets around their HQs, potentially providing unforeseen benefits for the residents around them and markets around them. While the whole package deal still seems like a net negative and shady to me, that certainly does fall into a potential (though very not proven) positive category.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#236

Post by hnmonkey »

kodablah wrote: post #224
hnmonkey wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because there are other and potentially better/easier ways to graft and siphon money out of the system (such as those you listed) doesn't mean that this person isn't allowed to think this 'lesser' one is just as morally bankrupt and from a business standpoint a foolish decision.

Agree and I usually try to stay on point and not whataboutist, but I had to address general comments about use of funds and role of government in parent and ggp.

Totally understood. Just wanted to make it obvious that if something is bad, a bigger bad doesn't make the other less bad. I think we're on the same page here.

Appreciate your clarification.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#239

Post by longerthoughts »

specialist wrote: post #182
tylerhou wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you measure progress? For the past decade, we've severely deteriorated as a society - Yet politicians will call it progress. Citation? By most metrics we've improved as a society in the last 10 years.

Not all of us see wage stagnation, growing inequity, debt accumulation as an improvement.

Net improvement doesn't require universal improvement. I'm not convinced that the world is better off now than it was a decade ago, but citing things like wage stagnation as proof that things have gotten worse is about as compelling as citing GDP as proof that things have gotten better. We will never see the day when all conceivable metrics have improved for all people.

Re: NY state tax break is $48k per Amazon HQ job

#240

Post by drchickensalad »

simplysimple wrote: post #237

crony capitalism at it's "finest". What a joke, of course - it's ok when New York elites do it but it's evvvvvvvviiiiiiiiiiiil when Donald Trump wants to give tax breaks to all Americans.

Literally nobody has claimed giving tax breaks to the 90% of Americans is evil. Your comment appears sololy meant to be inflammatory and promote low quality conversation.
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