Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

cnbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

221–230 of 503 posts

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#221

Post by mrits »

vrganj wrote: post #212
mrits wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a clear line and we fought Europe already over this in the last century. There is absolutely no world where we need a group of people telling us how long we are allowed to be on TikTok. It is inexcusable to think this way in a free democracy.

Part of a free democracy is that we get to think in whichever way we want, actually.

Democracy depends on shared rules and institutions that limit what you can do in pursuit of those beliefs. There is certainly a line to be drawn of where our freedoms begin and end. TikTok is nowhere near this

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#222

Post by achenet »

afavour wrote: post #149
shevy-java wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That rationale never convinced me. Smoking has definite physiological effects. Molecules bind to receptors or neurons and initiate cascades/responses. I don't see this with user interface in a browser at all. IF you wish to reason for that, why are regular ads allowed? They piss me off. Why do I have to see them? They cause my brain an addiction to want to buy crappy products. So why is there no ban here? Let's face…

> Yeah they try to restrict what we can do. We oldschool people call this fascism. Come on, this is an absurd statement. Governments regulate what people can do, yes. It’s part of their role. It’s why I can’t sell tainted meat on the street. It’s a good thing. Of course there is a line you can cross where the control becomes excessive but “the government sets rules around what people can do, that’s fascism!” is absur…

Yes.

Fascism isn't government making laws, fascism is "we're the superior race, kill anyone who disagrees".

I wouldn't call this move fascism, even if can be considered a bit heavy handed.

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#223

Post by tolerance »

Aurornis wrote: post #120
criddell wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the radio I heard a reporter talking about things China does during school exams. Apparently all schools have exams at the same time and during that period, social media shuts down at night. I forget the exact hours (10pm - 6am maybe). I'm starting to think that would be a great policy in general for everybody. I think they also said AI companies go offline during exam hours, but I may have got that wrong.

Absolutely wild that we’re seeing proposals to shut down parts of the internet and regulate when people can talk to each other on social platforms as a real suggestion on HN. I feel like we’ve completely lost the plot when we’re starting to invite government partial Internet shutdowns as a good idea. This is a totalitarian government play.

> I feel like we’ve completely lost the plot when we’re starting to invite government partial Internet shutdowns as a good idea. This is a totalitarian government play.

There's been criticism about the culture surrounding platforms like Mastodon/Bluesky that anticipated this.

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#224

Post by ErigmolCt »

wackget wrote: post #148
jrflo wrote: post #118

I heard someone on a podcast call social media algorithms "the modern-day cigarette" and that really resonated with me. These companies know their product is addictive and bad for users, but they keep pushing it anyways. Like cigarettes, it's bad for everyone, not just kids. I made an algorithm blocker for Safari because of that and it's actually crazy how much more pleasant social media is if you don't have recommen…

The modern-day cigarette is such a perfect metaphor for social media. A cabal of unfathomably wealthy companies spreading their harmful products across the world; making them as addictive as possible while actively burying the research which proves how harmful they are. I truly hope one day we'll look back on social media and smartphone use the same way we regard smoking.

I think the smoking comparison works best when applied to the engagement mechanics rather than "social media" as a whole

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#225

Post by tsunamifury »

bootsabota wrote: post #74
stingraycharles wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great example. These companies are already experts at circumventing taxes, what makes you think they can’t weasel their way around some arbitrary written law? Just look at the malicious compliance that Apple and Google have around the App Store stuff, they’ll find a way to comply with the law and implement different addictive dark patterns. I’m not saying that I disagree that these companies need to be regulated, I a…

Yeah it’s a tough situation to figure out. But here’s the real problem: people don’t care. And I say that as someone who hasn’t used social media since 2014. My observation of people’s behavior indicates that when all is said and done, people don’t care—they would rather get the endorphins from posting, liking, following, etc. But the solution is to allow people to control their own algorithm, and to have open source…

People don’t care because the broader reality offers no alternative today.

We have failed at creating a society with hope for the future.

This is like prohibition talk. It was all the avoid the fact that America in that period was a social hellscape.

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#226

Post by notarobot123 »

jrflo wrote: post #200
tolerance wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to make a similar accusation as the above but I skimmed your comments and it didn't seem like you were the sort to have ill intent behind bringing it up. Next time you might want to include one of those stuffy "Disclosure" notices.

That's a good idea, thank you for the feedback. I have a hard time finding the line between "advertising" and "sharing something I built" on this site sometimes.

but you should link to it in your bio for those of us still curious to find out what it is you built.

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#227

Post by achenet »

tencentshill wrote: post #114
Aurornis wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you present data by algorithm, you are no longer an impartial common carrier and are liable for the content you present Hacker News is a site that presents data by algorithm. Under your definition, Hacker News goes away, too. A more accurate framing would be that they’re going after personalized recommendation algorithms. It’s not obvious that offering a recommendation algorithm would mean that the site is no lo…

The algorithm is not personalized. It's the same for every user. No issue there.

The facebook/meta algo might be same for all users, but it had different inputs for each user.

HN, on the other hand, everyone has the same front page. If I like a post I can favorite it to 'bookmark' it, but HN won't modify my front page based on what I favorite, whereas facebook will.

I think the GP's argument is, when it comes to social media, "one size fits all" might be less addictive than "custom made" :)

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#228

Post by econ »

cyanydeez wrote: post #196
Aurornis wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you didn’t notice, this comment is an ad for a paid app trying to capitalize on social media anger. I respect the hustle, but this is not a neutral comment on the topic due to the financial interest. There are many free alternative plugins for targeting social media feeds if someone wants to filter these.

If you haven't been on HN, you'd believe this was some aberration as opposed to the norm. This is a YC run forum, so it's pretty normal for comments to contain software advertisment based comments.

I made a website 8 years ago for a business that was abandoned very early on by lack of time. Last week the first order came in.

Makes me curious, why should organic discovery not be a thing? How should it work?

I get that we don't want to look at promotional messages but do customers want to pay for advertising? I think many would be surprised how expensive it is to buy one customer. Some sectors more absurd than others.

I see lots of ads for things I know cost a tiny fraction of what is asked.

The idea everything is spam seems much to convenient for big business to be a coincidence.

I think we should go back to having a link to our website with each post. That actually makes it worth spending some time helping people.

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#229

Post by [deleted] »

anzerarkin wrote: post #22

I don’t think this is only a kids issue. A lot of adults need this too. The addictive apps are very well designed, while most blockers are either too easy to ignore or too annoying to keep using. I built a small iOS blocker because I had the same problem. Making it strict enough to actually work without making people hate it is the main challenge.

[deleted]

Re: EU to crack down on TikTok, Instagram's 'addictive design' targeting kids

#230

Post by vrganj »

mrits wrote: post #221
vrganj wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of a free democracy is that we get to think in whichever way we want, actually.

Democracy depends on shared rules and institutions that limit what you can do in pursuit of those beliefs. There is certainly a line to be drawn of where our freedoms begin and end. TikTok is nowhere near this

> Democracy depends on shared rules and institutions that limit what you can do in pursuit of those beliefs.

I agree fully. As such, our elected representatives can set those rules, i. e. ban the sale of heroin or algorithmic poisons.

> TikTok is nowhere near this

In a democracy, you don't get to decide that by yourself.

Post reply on HN