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Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

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Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#221

Post by angry_octet »

lolinder wrote: post #86
petee wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say especially when it's not costing Adobe anything to cancel your subscription, it's just a money grab. There are some exceptions where a fee is ok like when it's actually putting the business out financially, like Garmin & Iridium satellite service agreements, Garmin has little choice...but clearly not the case for Adobe

The whole idea of offering annual pricing is that the income stream is more consistent, so the price can be lower. It does hurt Adobe (not much relative to their income, but still some) to have that income not materialize. If you're not happy with a cancellation fee, that's what the monthly pricing is for—you pay more month to month but can cancel any time. It's a very normal trade-off. The only real alternatives Ado…

The problem is not the pricing break for a longer contract, but that the yearly contract was promoted as a monthly price (with no minimum fee clearly shown). I'm sure the A/B testing showed higher takeup if they wrote it that way -- it seems cheaper!

It isn't true that this is the only option. Instead of onerous lock-in like a gym membership they could have a sliding scale -- the longer you pay for it, the cheaper it gets. Their decision to go for annual lock-in is short term thinking.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#222

Post by cbmuser »

DominikPeters wrote: post #186
Mandatum wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is disingenuous at best, and fraudulent at worst - and I know ACCC in Australia will take a very dim view. Take the main page for instance, the one you linked - it lists monthly prices. No mention whatsoever of "annual pricing paid monthly" - it's JUST monthly mentioned. Pic: https://imgur.com/sZPfFDI When you click "See plans and pricing details" it gives you the Annual monthly and ACTUAL monthly prices. Pic: h…

You're getting lots of replies from (I presume) Americans, who are used to much scammier business behavior than what I know from Germany and you describe in Australia. One related example is the pervasive practice in America of displaying a price without fees (like "resort fees" for hotels that can be +50%) and of course taxes, with the actual price only becoming apparent after additional effort is invested in the ch…

> You're getting lots of replies from (I presume) Americans, who are used to much scammier business behavior than what I know from Germany and you describe in Australia.

Berlin‘s public transport company has the exact condition in their terms of service.

> https://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/streit-ueber-monatskarten...

(„ Zudem sei eine Kündigung für Abonnenten unattraktiv, da sich für die schon genutzten Monate nachträglich der Preis erhöhe, hieß es.“)

It‘s definitely not a scam or rip-off, just a case of someone not reading the contract before signing it.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#223

Post by hansvm »

Mandatum wrote: post #189
DominikPeters wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're getting lots of replies from (I presume) Americans, who are used to much scammier business behavior than what I know from Germany and you describe in Australia. One related example is the pervasive practice in America of displaying a price without fees (like "resort fees" for hotels that can be +50%) and of course taxes, with the actual price only becoming apparent after additional effort is invested in the ch…

True, my views are non-American. For example when I go to a convenience store, I pay the price listed on the item. I don't have to do math in my head that's +x% sales or state tax. That type of practice just isn't acceptable anywhere else.

It's even enshrined into law in some states and locales. A few businesses have tried to market themselves as "no-nonsense, no-bullshit" and put the right prices on things, but that's totally illegal in parts of the US.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#224

Post by dmingod666 »

michaelmrose wrote: post #127
paxys wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are stretching the definition of convoluted. Offering discounts for signing a longer-term contract is standard practice in every industry. Don't need to be a lawyer to figure that out.

There is no reason to give billion dollar companies with a staff of thousands of full time workers which have meetings in which professional designers meet with professional decision makers to approve of each step in a web store before it goes live the benefit of the doubt instead of the customer who spends 2 minutes in a web form. If it looks dishonest it probably is. On this page https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud…

If you can proceed to buy something and not even bother to read the first word of the product name, which is "Annual" -- you can't claim to be cheated.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#225

Post by renewiltord »

dmingod666 wrote: post #217
Mandatum wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's only clear in 1 of the pictures I shared. That is on the "Plans and Details" page. It's "clear enough" in the other. That is on the Buy Now page. The price is listed as annualized and the REAL monthly price is hidden from view under a drop-down. This is an acceptably deceptive UX practice for pricing. I can give some room for shitty tactics, this is it. However - it's not clear at all in the first picture I shar…

How deceptive is it from 1-10, if the name of the product starts with the word "Annual".

It doesn't on the first page so that's a 9 and it does on the second page after click through so that's a 1.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#226

Post by Maxion »

dmingod666 wrote: post #211
forgingahead wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is precisely why it's unlikely any regulation will occur to stop this at the source. As long as American customers are happy to bend over to shady business practices by dominant American businesses, the rest of the world will keep experiencing the knock-on effects of this behaviour.

In your country if you get into a yearly contract to rent a place and then break the contract in 2 months. Are there any consequences for the person breaking the contract?

Of course, if there is no real reason to break the lease. E.g. if you're moving to a different city for work or starting to study.

Further, if something is advertised as XX Eur/mo it's implied it's a month-by-month thing. Situations you described are very very clearly marked as being a contract with a start and an end date as well as a total including any and all fees as well as cancelation terms. You can't hide essential terms deep within a several page legalese document.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#227

Post by cbmuser »

paxys wrote: post #179
danShumway wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, then give me access for 50% of the remaining year. If I'm being charged money for a service, I should have a comparable level of access to that service.

You will have access to 100% of the service if you hold up your side of the contract you signed.

Exactly. It’s a contract. If you cancel it early, the other contract partner has the right to get a compensation fee.

That’s perfectly normal and also practised by other companies.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#228

Post by anilakar »

greggman3 wrote: post #65
Mandatum wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is disingenuous at best, and fraudulent at worst - and I know ACCC in Australia will take a very dim view. Take the main page for instance, the one you linked - it lists monthly prices. No mention whatsoever of "annual pricing paid monthly" - it's JUST monthly mentioned. Pic: https://imgur.com/sZPfFDI When you click "See plans and pricing details" it gives you the Annual monthly and ACTUAL monthly prices. Pic: h…

When you click the "buy" button it's made clear https://imgur.com/uUqd9ZY Reminds me of car advertising. They don't show the full price of the lease. They show the monthly payments

Which, BTW, is illegal under most sane consumer protection laws, where the full price of the contract must always be shown. No annual price, no annual contract. Simple.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#229

Post by dmingod666 »

DominikPeters wrote: post #183
michaelmrose wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no reason to give billion dollar companies with a staff of thousands of full time workers which have meetings in which professional designers meet with professional decision makers to approve of each step in a web store before it goes live the benefit of the doubt instead of the customer who spends 2 minutes in a web form. If it looks dishonest it probably is. On this page https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud…

Even if you bother to read the small print, it appears to be written to be deliberately misleading. Instead of positively saying that one enters an annual commitment, it only says that there is "No annual commitment required after the first year". "Cancel anytime" suggests you can stop your contract, not that you have the option to pre-pay the remaining months and forfeit your access.

Correct, it's misleading if you chose to ignore the words "after the first year".

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#230

Post by sellyme »

sk5t wrote: post #114
deathanatos wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first screenshot in the comment you're replying to says the price is "$52.99/mo". A reasonable person would look at that and conclude that if they purchased the product for 1 month, they would pay $52.99. But it seems (from the other, subsequent screenshots) that the actual cost Adobe would charge is $635.88. (That $52.99/mo, for a year.) It is only on subsequent screens that the bait and switch becomes visible.…

Automobile leases, apartments, and the like are listed with monthly rates, but your commitment to pay is longer than one month. What's the difference?

> Automobile leases, apartments, and the like are listed with monthly rates

Where I live it it is illegal to display this without also including the total amount over the entire contract period.

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