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A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

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Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#221

Post by julianlam »

WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #207
TeMPOraL wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. Also, the shape of the growth curve matters. It's superlinear with the number of participants, and even with no new participants, the amount of waste grows over time by design . If an evil overlord wanted to exacerbate our climate and energy problems, pushing Bitcoin to mainstream use is probably the ideal way to do it.

> It's superlinear with the number of participants, and even with no new participants, the amount of waste grows over time by design. Incorrect, growth curve is driven by mining power and forces innovation in lower cost of electricity. The worldwide cost of Bitcoin usage in KW has been compared to the headquarters of Bank of America's usage.

> The worldwide cost of Bitcoin usage in KW has been compared to the headquarters of Bank of America's usage.

You seem to be missing a couple units there...

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#222

Post by rootusrootus »

Zak wrote: post #59
samatman wrote: post #38

Literally every one of the existing options still works. Ok with charging at 5w? Plug your lightning-to-A cable into the little tiny cube charger they've been selling since forever. Already have a faster USB charger? It works. Ok with Qi at 7W? Works Oh, you want the new shiny MagSafe puck system? Great. Buy it. This analysis completely ignores that the new shiny system is supposed to be a better experience . It's co…

I'm disappointed Apple hasn't dropped Lightning and just made all their devices use standard USB-C. I could see their motivation for developing their own connector when everyone else was using micro-B, which has a number of disadvantages, but now USB-C is used to power virtually every other phone and tablet, and many laptops including Apple's own.

I mostly agree, but I'd whine a little about having to buy more charging bricks. I don't really need fast charging, but I have a bunch of little devices to charge and almost all of them support USB-A. AFAICT all current USB-C charging bricks are limited to 3 (maybe 4?) ports. And those are expensive. I've already got a few of the 6-port bricks. I suppose this is because USB-C is potentially faster (PD) so they can't support more than a few ports per charger. Still, it's been a hassle with my iPad Pro. It's kind of the bastard child of my collection, and it just barely agrees to be charged with a USB-A to USB-C cable (it doesn't always agree to charge from a completely drained state, but it does charge if it's already got enough juice to turn on).

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#223

Post by dwaite »

ochoseis wrote: post #127
toast0 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't Apple giving you a new option here? Before, you were forced to buy the bundled wall wart, now you have the option to keep using what you had or buy a charger if you need it? They're still forcing a bundled cable, but it's a different cable you probably don't have many of?

The equivalent option would be to offer the charger by default, and allow eco conscious consumers to opt out. Making it opt-in for folks without a working charger would strike a nice balance, even if it’s not feasible.

It is opt-in for people without a working charger - they sell chargers, or you can buy one of the many third party ones.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#224

Post by croddin »

ashtonkem wrote: post #143

I really hate arguments about how much electricity wireless phone charging wastes because it makes people feel like they’re doing something when in fact they aren’t. Charging a cell phone every day for a year consumes about 1-2 kWh per phone. The average American household consumes 10,399 kWh per year, meaning that a typical smart phone consumes one 5000th, (0.02%) of a typical home’s electricity (excl. natural gas)…

I think there is a good chance MagSafe chargers will last significantly longer. Lightning cables seem to eventually get damaged on the connector or with the cable bending if it is being used while charging. If wireless MagSafe uses more electricity it will be worth it if offsets enough need to replace broken cables and the energy used in producing those.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#225

Post by jiofih »

jonny_eh wrote: post #57
jiofih wrote: post #54

All of the iPad and Macbook charging bricks have been USB-C for a while, there is definitely a huge population of users that already have one. Plus, you know, it plugs into any usb-c port, it doesn’t have to be white. You can also get a standard Qi charger for what, $15?

But they don't support the new faster Magsafe charging in the iPhone 12.

Are you sure? Those chargers are 30W and 60W.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#226

Post by acqq »

ashtonkem wrote: post #143

I really hate arguments about how much electricity wireless phone charging wastes because it makes people feel like they’re doing something when in fact they aren’t. Charging a cell phone every day for a year consumes about 1-2 kWh per phone. The average American household consumes 10,399 kWh per year, meaning that a typical smart phone consumes one 5000th, (0.02%) of a typical home’s electricity (excl. natural gas)…

> With wireless charging being 60-75% efficient, the literal worst case scenario is that you go from 2kWh to 3kWh.

Maybe the difference isn’t so low as you estimate it? Maybe the wired chargers use much less power when the phone is not being charged, compared to the wireless chargers? Then the difference could be approximately 0 (as your phone is charged only a few hours per day) to approximately N kWh (due to a constant power draw — nobody will buy a wireless charger to keep it unplugged).

Otherwise, I agree that not upgrading the phone saves even more.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#227

Post by dheera »

Spooky23 wrote: post #216
dheera wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO the single biggest environmentally-unfriendly move Apple made is not allowing user serviceability. Even a simple ability to swap your phone's battery for a new one would reduce a lot of emissions. But they want you to spend $$$ on new stuff, so they make it hard for you to fix. And on laptops, soldered SSDs, soldered RAM, non-swappable batteries. You HAVE to buy a new PC even if you just want a little more hard d…

I think the sales aspect is a secondary consideration. IMO the primary is ensuring that there are minimal incidents of battery fires or other mishaps. Avoiding that hazard plus the bad PR is a major consideration... remember when the Galaxy Note was banished from planes? For Samsung it’s a much bigger impact. They have a wider temperature operating range and advertise heavily to police, construction and similar outdo…

> minimal incidents of battery fires or other mishaps

How many times have we had fires with Lenovo laptops, Canon/Nikon/Sony cameras, Dewalt/Ryobi/Makita power tools, and the million other devices that have replaceable Lithium batteries?

As long as users are using OEM batteries, there isn't any greater risk of battery fires, and as long as you price the OEM batteries reasonably, users will use them.

In fact I'd claim that it's safer to have a removeable battery, because if it starts bulging, you can eject it, and dispose of it safely, and replace it, instead of fussing around with first getting your precious files off the soldered SSD while it charges a dangerous bulging battery before you finally send the laptop in for $$$ service.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#228

Post by zamadatix »

e40 wrote: post #84
Zak wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm disappointed Apple hasn't dropped Lightning and just made all their devices use standard USB-C. I could see their motivation for developing their own connector when everyone else was using micro-B, which has a number of disadvantages, but now USB-C is used to power virtually every other phone and tablet, and many laptops including Apple's own.

Given the amount of discussion USB-C gets here on HN, maybe it's not such a clear decision? I think the biggest risk in USB-C, for me, it makes me really nervous when I buy a cable, and even then I'm not 100% confident. When I buy a lightning cable, I have no fears. And they're not even more expensive anymore. Some of those USB-C cables are just as expensive.

No matter one's take on generic USB type C cables even if you only used an Apple branded USB type C charging cable at least you'd be able to use the cable with other devices too.

I.e. it's always a lose situation to have the non-standard cable. Either a generic USB cable would be better or the Apple brand cable would be better for more than just your Apple device.

That being said USB C cables for phone charging aren't where people usually run into the USB C standard confusion anyways.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#229

Post by ThatPlayer »

blackguardx wrote: post #214
petre wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USB-C is great but the Lightning connector is still better designed. Oh and you can downvote me all you want, I'm an electrical engineer, not an Apple fanboy. Don't like the phone. Anyway, they should at least include a cable.

I disagree and think the USB-C connector is better designed. Exposing electrical contacts to the environment like on the Lightning connector is bad for several reasons, including increased risk of static electricity damage and wear on the exposed electrical contacts. Apple has gone to great lengths to reduce or eliminate the static electricity risk by integrating a special IC into the cable. The contact wear issue ha…

I think mechanically, the Lightning port is fine, my issues with it are more about how it requires an expensive active converter to output HDMI.

A lightning to HDMI adapter really has a decoder as the phone streams compressed video to it. Which lowers the quality and raises the price.

Re: A Guy Walks into an Apple Store

#230

Post by totalZero »

bobbylarrybobby wrote: post #131
paxys wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While people do have a million chargers lying around from over the years, almost none of them will work with the new iPhone. The average Apple enthusiast will still end up buying one or more separately.

The phone doesn’t care about the brick. It only cares about one end of the cable. All your old USB-A lightning cables still work with their USB-A bricks.

It is my understanding that what you describe is not how charging works nowadays. For example, the new 15W MagSafe charger doesn't work at 15W if you plug it into any old brick. A particular charging profile (voltage and current) must be negotiated between and supported by both the charger and the device.
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