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Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

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Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#221

Post by j-pb »

phkahler wrote: post #216
013a wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or just dont care because they get to take in money for every user of MS/linux hybrid. Oh my god, the horror. Are you suggesting that I could, I dare to think it, pay Microsoft some money for a working operating system that meets all of my needs? Someone needs to call the EU and get this shut down, this is unacceptable behavior. Look, this fear out of the linux community is why I'm hesitant to immerse myself in it.…

>> Oh my god, the horror. Are you suggesting that I could, I dare to think it, pay Microsoft some money for a working operating system that meets all of my needs? You are free to do that now. Maybe Linux meets your needs, or maybe Windows, or something else. >> Lets say I decide to build a linux app that is dependent on Microsoft APIs, as you fear: what's stopping you from just not using it? If Microsoft allows this,…

Microsoft is no longer the enemy of OS, Apple is.

M$ knows this.

It's time the Linux community starts to realise it too.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#222

Post by vms20591 »

aunty_helen wrote: post #3

>Windows 10 is on a path to becoming a hybrid Windows/Linux system This sounds promising, something closer to OSX would give apple competition for devs like myself that want a linux based system and a fluffy "it-just-works" gui

I've seen a comment in reddit sometime before that said, "I would use Linux if it had all the programs I use day to day in Microsoft Windows". Though I can understand this, Microsoft providing support for Linux inside Windows is far from being the right approach. Its only going to make users stay on it. Rather, software makers should release their products for Linux as well. Microsoft is working towards the goal making Windows the de facto platform for all kinds of users.

People - users, developers, artists or anyone, should see this beyond software. They should see the philosophy that drives it, the "Free Software" movement paved way for an ecosystem where "Knowledge Freedom" was more important.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#223

Post by etripe »

phkahler wrote: post #216
013a wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> or just dont care because they get to take in money for every user of MS/linux hybrid. Oh my god, the horror. Are you suggesting that I could, I dare to think it, pay Microsoft some money for a working operating system that meets all of my needs? Someone needs to call the EU and get this shut down, this is unacceptable behavior. Look, this fear out of the linux community is why I'm hesitant to immerse myself in it.…

>> Oh my god, the horror. Are you suggesting that I could, I dare to think it, pay Microsoft some money for a working operating system that meets all of my needs? You are free to do that now. Maybe Linux meets your needs, or maybe Windows, or something else. >> Lets say I decide to build a linux app that is dependent on Microsoft APIs, as you fear: what's stopping you from just not using it? If Microsoft allows this,…

As someone who obviously cares about open software, how do you feel about Apple's increasingly consumer hostile actions and their walled garden ecosystem? Haven't they "embraced, extended and extinguished" Linux in a very real way?

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#224

Post by etripe »

jacquesm wrote: post #119
baryphonic wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently had an issue with my Linux Mint desktop where a power outage somehow introduced a hard disk error that was not easy to resolve (unless one knows exactly what to look for in the logs and knows the correct `fsck` incantation from memory). Linux is definitely still worth it, but the "just works" factor is just significantly less than MacOS.

If that had happened to you on Windows instead of doing an fsck you might have had to re-install from scratch. And I've had OS/X helpfully suggest to 'initialize a harddrive' with some perfectly good data and a borked boot block on it. Fixing that took a lot more magic than just an fsck, no matter what the incantations. Once you have trouble at that level any OS will be tricky to get going again because a lot of the…

Windows has a fsck equivalent called chkdsk, and as far as I recall it's available from command-line only safe mode, or whatever that thing is called from the boot menu.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#225

Post by larrik »

larrik wrote: post #82
severino wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know lot of people use excel, and can't live without it. Anyway, the point is that we can blame Linux for kernel or driver issues, its thousands of desktop environments for its bugs, etc, but I don't think it's fair to say that Linux "doesn't work" just because Microsoft will never release Linux versions of their desktop software. I have a working Linux desktop and I also use spreadsheets in my day to day work.

I can barely tell the difference between Excel and LibreOffice Calc with both of them open on the same computer...

I'm getting downvoted, but the fact is that up until like 10 years ago I vastly preferred Calc over Excel. It had a lot less stupid built in causing me to lose my work. Excel would clear my undo history on save, or close ALL worksheets when I tried to close one (completely different behavior than Word) and I would miss which file it was warning me about.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#226

Post by paulryanrogers »

013a wrote: post #197
paulryanrogers wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right but the larger point is that it's less healthy long term since Microsoft controls DX, full stop. So it makes direct Vulcan support less appealing.

Sure, but its been, like, thirty years . The biggest advancement specifically Linux gaming has had in that time is a highly optimized DX interpolation layer from Valve (Proton, an extension of WINE). The linux community seems to believe that the world will just naturally bias toward open systems given enough time. Maybe Vulcan will own the world in a hundred years; we'll wait it out. But there's no evidence that this…

Did Linux start out better at a lot of server things? My experience was it was just cheaper, and significantly so.

When my employer moved from Mac servers to Debian it was mostly slower performing and less obvious with the lack of a GUI.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#228

Post by derefr »

phkahler wrote: post #215
derefr wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is the point of bringing native DX12 to linux if not that? Oh, easy: it’s so games written for DX12 on Windows—that are currently run on Linux using Wine—can have a direct, low-overhead GPU driver path, rather than Wine needing to translate DX12 calls into OpenGL/Vulkan calls first. Of course, if you’re a game-engine developer, you know you can achieve the same by just writing your engine to target Vulkan inst…

>> > What is the point of bringing native DX12 to linux if not that? >> Oh, easy: it’s so games written for DX12 on Windows—that are currently run on Linux using Wine And why does Microsoft give two shits about that?

I said above: because Microsoft (or rather, their Xbox division) owns a bunch of gaming studios, and acts as their publisher. And one of the roles of a publisher, is to get the games the publisher has rights to, ported to more systems, to get them into the hands of more people, to make more money.

Make no mistake: any time an Xbox title isn’t explicitly chosen to be a “console exclusive” for marketing purposes, Microsoft would love nothing more than to port it to every system imaginable. Look at what they did with Minecraft.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#229

Post by wkearney99 »

Acinyx wrote: post #126
matkoniecz wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"you will never have working audio" - what you mean by that? Some specific software not working on Linux or complete lack of audio? I run into some cases of software refusing to run on Linux (though curiously, I switched to Linux due to software refusing to work on Windows). I run into wifi/printer issues (but both on Linux and Windows) and I managed Linux to Work, while Windows remained resistant to debugging and ke…

One example I found recently is bluetooth headsets: On Windows it by defaults uses the high quality audio output profile, but switches to "headset" profile when an app requires a microphone and picks the headset. On Linux (Ubuntu to be precise) you have to manually pick the profile somewhere deep in Pulse, making the usage of the microphone pretty hard as you first have to figure out how to change it and secondly nee…

With the advent of more people working at home, with a greater variety of headphone/headset devices it's even more of a hassle to use linux for daily work tasks. Not that you can't, obviously, but if you're not a developer or sysadmin-inclined, it's a mess trying to get a linux desktop lashed together.

Re: Microsoft submits Linux kernel patches to enable complete Hyper-V on Linux

#230

Post by aunty_helen »

Abishek_Muthian wrote: post #100
aunty_helen wrote: post #3

>Windows 10 is on a path to becoming a hybrid Windows/Linux system This sounds promising, something closer to OSX would give apple competition for devs like myself that want a linux based system and a fluffy "it-just-works" gui

>something closer to OSX would give apple competition for devs like myself that want a linux based system Apple has been consistently removing native *nix tools from the system with every iteration. I was recently surprised to see it still had SFTP built-in (although I'm not sure how long that would last). But, homebrew still does save the day. I wonder whether binary notarization requirements will affect that too.

Exactly, if apple wants to keep people buying 6 grand laptops they need to realise removing tools like scp that 1% of their users use isn't going to be ok if there's a competent alternative.
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