How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind • Hacker News Board

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#221

Post by textor » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:49 PM UTC

yardie wrote: post #179

EpicEng wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're getting downvoted, and maybe most of that is a sentiment of "we have to deal with the problem at hand", which is absolutely the only thing an outsider can do, but you're not wrong. My wife works in a low income school, largest and poorest in the area (a relatively large city.) Pumping more money in does not help. More after school problems does not help much. As far as academic achievement is concerned, these…

I come from one of those large, poor inner city schools. The money and after school programs absolutely help. I am a product of those after school programs. That additional money paid for musical instruments, sports, computers, and transportation. I feel personally insulted when people say we shouldn't fund these afterschool programs because they don't feel they are working.

Anecdotal experiences are near worthless when discussing policies, though. Feel insulted all you like; statistically speaking, these resources are wasted. Chances are you'd be equally well off without them.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#222

Post by eitally » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:50 PM UTC

masklinn wrote: post #68

roland35 wrote: post #50

I am excited about this approach and I think LeBron's organization has put a lot of though and work with experts on this project. - This school is a true public school and not a charter school. In Ohio a lot of charter schools can have some degree of selection in their students and kick out families which don't meet the requirements which leads to more at-risk students left to the public schools. This school is makin…

> Longer school days, 3 meals, and a longer school year helps students stay focused. The middle one is absolutely true, the other two I really doubt e.g. in Finland or Germany, schoolday starts around 9AM and ends around 2PM, yielding 3h30 to 4h studies a day accounting for breaks, 5 days/week, with little homework (maybe 5h/week total). Afternoon is usually dedicated to clubs.

Longer school days help parents hold down full time jobs. A longer school year eliminates the need for babysitters or camps in the 10-12wk summer break, and also provides continuity of curriculum. Food is pretty easy and many schools are providing at least two meals already. A good number have things like backpack programs[1], also, to send food home (either in the evening or more commonly for the weekend).

[1] http://www.feedingamerica.org/our-work/hunger-relief-program...

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#223

Post by lemoncucumber » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

gnat wrote: post #81

masklinn wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Longer school days, 3 meals, and a longer school year helps students stay focused. The middle one is absolutely true, the other two I really doubt e.g. in Finland or Germany, schoolday starts around 9AM and ends around 2PM, yielding 3h30 to 4h studies a day accounting for breaks, 5 days/week, with little homework (maybe 5h/week total). Afternoon is usually dedicated to clubs.

And research consistently shows that teenagers perform better if you start school later in the day than 7am. E.g., http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0192636502086633... "shifted the school start timefrom 7:15 a. m. to 8:40 a. m. This article examines that change, finding significant benefits such as improved attendance and enrollment rates, less sleeping in class, and less student-reported depression." http…

The high school I went to looked into shifting the start time later because of research like this. Unfortunately, they concluded that it wasn't feasible because of after school sports -- our teams play against other high schools in the area, and the timing of that is based on when all the schools start. So if one school wants to start later, its students wouldn't be done in time for sports games and such. Pretty lame.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#224

Post by s73v3r_ » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

Invictus0 wrote: post #32

I'm wondering if this school will be sustainable in the long term. Given the correlation between low-income neighborhoods and poor school performance, how is I Promise going to be supported by taxpayers? Many school districts scrounge for basic supplies; how long will they be able to keep this free bike program going?

This is the wealthiest nation on earth. The money exists to keep this school going, and do not let anyone fool you into saying it doesn't.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#225

Post by satsuma » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

akhilcacharya wrote: post #195

ythn wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One nice thing about 3 month summer is the ability to get a temporary job. When I was in high school I worked every summer as a landscaper/food service/lifeguard/etc. and gained lots of experience/money I otherwise wouldn't have gotten. With year round school that doesn't seem possible.

I don't think you're losing anything in low-skill jobs like that by not working a continuous 3 months instead of 3 weeks at a time.

places definitely don't want to expend resources hiring someone for three weeks just to have them leave, then come back, in a cycle. they want 3 months all in a row.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#226

Post by dharmon » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

nemo44x wrote: post #85

AlwaysRock wrote: post #55

It's great to see superstars like LeBron doing something like this. Say what you want about him as a player but you cant knock him as a philanthropist.

I'm not a fan boy or anything but he's a rather remarkable person. To take advantage of the biological attributes he was given and work insanely hard to maximize them from a young age. All while not being distracted by all the other things that could lead to squandering his natural talents. And then not relying just on those but enhancing them through dedication and discipline. Then you throw in all the pressure he h…

And he's hilarious! I thought he stole the show in "Trainwreck".

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#227

Post by soperj » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

house9-2 wrote: post #208

neuland wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the problem is toxic home environments though, why aren't people suggesting that we cut out the middle man and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it? It seems that everyone is recognizing this is the problem, but the solutions all revolve around school, when it really doesn't have anything to do with schools. Edit: Or boarding schools.

> ...and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it who is going to fund that? wouldn't it be better to support the families as they are? help improve peoples lives instead of ripping families apart

Same people funding these insane school programs?

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#228

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:52 PM UTC

JamesBarney wrote: post #203

neuland wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the problem is toxic home environments though, why aren't people suggesting that we cut out the middle man and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it? It seems that everyone is recognizing this is the problem, but the solutions all revolve around school, when it really doesn't have anything to do with schools. Edit: Or boarding schools.

Because it is really hard to compete with the love a parent, even a really shitty one.

[deleted]

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#229

Post by textor » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:54 PM UTC

house9-2 wrote: post #208

neuland wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the problem is toxic home environments though, why aren't people suggesting that we cut out the middle man and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it? It seems that everyone is recognizing this is the problem, but the solutions all revolve around school, when it really doesn't have anything to do with schools. Edit: Or boarding schools.

> ...and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it who is going to fund that? wouldn't it be better to support the families as they are? help improve peoples lives instead of ripping families apart

For what it's worth, children from at-risk families achieve better education when the father ends up incarcerated. So we can absolutely make a case for "ripping families apart" and against supporting "families as they are".

> My findings suggest that on average, parents who are on the margin of incarceration are likely to reduce the amount of schooling their child attains if they instead remain in the household. This can be explained because the removal from the household of a violent parent or a negative role model can create a safer environment for a child (Johnson, 2008; Jaffee et al., 2003). Incarceration is also a mechanism that can limit the intergenerational transmission of violence, substance abuse, and crime to children. This result also relates to findings in other fields that conclude that See Kling (2006), Aizer and Doyle, 2013; Di Tella and Schargrodsky (2013), Mueller-Smith, 2015; and Bhuller et al., 2016, among others. For example, using data from Sweden, Hjalmarsson and Lindquist (2007) report significant father-son correlations in criminal activity that begin to appear between ages 7 and 12, and are 3 the positive effects of being raised by one’s parents depend on the quality of care they can provide (Jaffee et al., 2003).

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5664c583e4b0c0bb910ce...

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#230

Post by bradlys » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 4:55 PM UTC

pbreit wrote: post #131

The most interesting thing to me is that it is eschewing being a charter or private school and apparently expects to be able to work within the confines of the local school district and teachers' union. I've never really understood why this is usually considered difficult or impossible for such a project. Also, with 25-30 kids per class, $10k works to $250k-300k per year which seems sufficient for a teacher, aide, fa…

I too was thinking along these lines but I think these are inflated numbers.

Average class room size is 21.6 for elementary schools that are self-contained (26 for departmentalized). https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/sass/tables/sass1112_2013314_t1s... I think the desire is for 20 or less. When you're dealing with children, a lot of teachers are required.

So let's say LeBron is going for 20:1. Then it's now $200k per class. Let's say half of that goes to the teacher due to competitive pay and payroll tax + healthcare + benefits. You're looking at $5k/student for 3 healthy meals a day, facilities, and everything else.

Doesn't seem like very much anymore. You could dock teacher pay more but it won't probably be enough to outweigh the cons.

One could also try to up the ratio of students:teachers but then you're just going to give the kids a worse education and the teachers a much worse teaching environment. I think having a small classroom size is pretty important for kids who are struggling as they need more attention. And this school is literally for struggling kids - so there's gonna be a lot of competition for attention.