I wonder how many people will be unable to get a refund from Apple for the app.
My refund was processed immediately.
Mine has not been processed yet, but it has only been a few hours.
Just doesn’t feel good
221–230 of 315 posts
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can you or anyone else tell me if The Deck ads still track and employ targeting. If they do, then personally I'd consider them still invasive and worth blocking. If not, then I see his point.
marco claims Deck doesn't track, per link above
Thank you. I should have clicked the link before posting. I'd agree that a better option would have been to have an ad network whitelist option to reward those who strive for improving UX. Tough spot to be in.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#223Even with the app [temporary] pulled, it now showed there is money to be made from ad blockers, so it's only a matter of time before clones appear in the appstore.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#224After this (pulling the app after 2 days) I will be very hesitant to ever buy anything made by Marco again. Hopefully Apple processes my refund.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#225This series of tweets from Anil Dash might give some insight into why Marco decided to pull Peace. Basically while the big publishers of content can adapt to ads being blocked and create native ads or sell "featured content", small publishers like blogs dont have the time to work on that and rely on third-party ad tech like Google AdSense for monetization. Worth a read: https://twitter.com/anildash/status/64456033636…
I think—maybe?—his thesis is based on a flawed assumption: that for advertisements to be a "good user experience" they need to be native and served by the site themselves. I think—maybe?—that ad networks can exist in such a way that they continue to provide outsourced services to sites, without being obnoxious.
Is this impossible?
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#226Earlier quoted context omitted.
Paywalls are inconvenient, and in some cases arguably inappropriate. It's annoying to follow a link to a paywall. Complaining about that != "reviled." But none of that is as intrusive as modern ad tech. Ads dug their own grave, slowly, gradually, and are now shocked to find people are shoveling dirt in on top of them. Moreover, ad blockers are a proportionate response to Web bugs, trackers, and ad tech in general. E-…
I actually agree with you about adtech. I simply disagree about what the ethical response to the problem is. To me, the answer to "overly intrusive adtech" is "stop patronizing sites that deploy it".
My main point was that paywalls, and subscription services in general, are not really reviled. They are just annoying in some contexts, like linking.
But I also think it's futile to ask a mass audience that rightfully feels abused by ad tech to be ethical about what they do about ads. But even if they do consider ethics, ad blockers are a proportionate response to intrusive ad tech. A fancy way to say "trackers, Web bugs, and other icky tricks are getting what they deserve."
Lastly, it isn't up to the audience to fix this. It is entirely up to ad-funded publishers. Some will go to paywalls. I'm not that optimistic that ad tech developers can let go of their dark patterns. That's a business that might crash before it reforms, or at least retreats into balkanized walled gardens. Too many paychecks depend on not understanding that.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#227* I don't want ads * I don't want native advertising or sponsored content * I don't want to pay for content * I don't want my tax goes to government sponsored content * I want free independent content That's me nowadays... I don't even know what's the answer!
I want syndication, where I pay a reasonable amount per month for ad-free access to a number of sites of my choice.
Someday I'll understand why nobody has put something like this together, but I'm not there yet.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#228Earlier quoted context omitted.
2 days is a short period of time, but the context over those days is massively different. On Sept 16th, a few dozen beta testers may have been using Peace and giving Marco feedback. On Sept 18, Peace is the top ranked app in the app store, displacing MineCraft. MineCraft! Estimates are in the 12000-15000 downloads on the first day[1]. You look in your iTunes connect account and realize you on the path to make $100K o…
> realize you on the path to make $100K on an app that, rightly or wrongly, could impact other people's livelihoods Because someone giving me 100k for an app which wrote, to use it for the exact purpose I made it for is certainly /the/ reason I would change my mind about making it... > and subject me to a torrent of unpleasantness. But that’ll end soon enough, and that’s better than how I’d feel if I kept going. What…
So you're saying your idea of what's moral is different. The "what he doesn't say" and "cares about this sort of thing" is completely unfounded and callous. Not exactly useful.
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#229Earlier quoted context omitted.
2 days is a short period of time, but the context over those days is massively different. On Sept 16th, a few dozen beta testers may have been using Peace and giving Marco feedback. On Sept 18, Peace is the top ranked app in the app store, displacing MineCraft. MineCraft! Estimates are in the 12000-15000 downloads on the first day[1]. You look in your iTunes connect account and realize you on the path to make $100K o…
I don't believe he wrote an app hoping to have a small user base, so I don't believe that the success of the app was the problem. Without to mention that there are a number of ways to fix that, including finding a price point that makes it less interesting in order to reduces the installation base. But if the app was created in the first place, it was because the idea was to make everybody install it. It's a blackbox…
> I don't believe he wrote an app hoping to have a small user base, so I don't believe that the success of the app was the problem.
Absolutely agreed. All else aside, I don't really believe someone goes through the trouble of building, launching and promoting an iOS application on the app store (with all its hurdles) with the thought, "Gee, I really hope it doesn't get too popular!"
I'm not Marco (nor have I ever talked to him) and I'm not trying to put myself into his head space. Moreover, I absolutely despise a conspiracy theory. I'm simply saying that the explanation he gave, true or not, does not make sense to me so I personally choose not to believe it. If I were Marco and reading my comment, my response would be, "Good for you; I honestly couldn't care less what you think."
Re: Just doesn’t feel good
#230Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seriously. This move makes sense without any conspiracy theories. Just look at his other recent blog post about Peace: http://www.marco.org/2015/09/17/why-peace-blocks-deck-ads It looks like he just felt uncomfortable making money off of his friends' and colleagues' loss. Makes sense, really, even if some posters can't seem to fathom giving up money to sleep soundly at night.
Makes sense, really, even if some posters can't seem to fathom giving up money to sleep soundly at night. This is like kicking kittens and then announcing to the world that you're going to stop kicking kittens. Then why kick kittens in the first place? No one made Marco create an ad blocking app. No one demanded his coordination with Ghostery. No one demanded that he announce it with great fanfare on his site. Morali…
After my post has been moderated down to the abyss, Marco has announced that he has given the app code to Ghostery, who'll certainly release an app in short order. And for which all logic states Arment will receive financial considerations.
My post above is completely accurate. The moral grandstanding is an embarrassment, and it's worse how well this noise works on HN.