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How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

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Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#211

Post by itistoday2 »

Frondo wrote: post #209
itistoday2 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are free to move to another country. Please explain how I can do that. I would actually like to move to Switzerland, could you explain how I can freely do that as everything I've researched indicates it's neither free nor possible in any reasonable amount of time. If not Switzerland I'll settle for some other country where I can live freely and be safe from coercion. > If no automobile maker will sell you the e…

You can leave the U.S. whenever you want. The U.S. isn't restricting your ability to leave. If the country of your choice doesn't permit you to emigrate, that doesn't mean that you're suddenly free from your obligations to whatever country will host you. Wouldn't that be convenient? "Sir, I don't have to pay taxes. I want to move to Switzerland, but they're full right now, so I can't." (And the "threat of prison" is…

It doesn't help if all other countries both severely restrict entry and/or force a tax upon you. I'd just end up in the same exact situation.

> And the "threat of prison" is some of the dumbest hyperbole...

It's not hyperbole. If you willfully fail to file that's grounds for imprisonment:

http://www.businessinsider.com/terrible-things-that-could-ha...

You're probably thinking of cases when people "forget" or make "mistakes" in their filing.

> ...out of the antitax crowd

I mentioned this already, I am not anti-tax. Please cut it with the labeling. It's late. We're going in circles. Have a good night, I won't be replying to whatever you post next.

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#212

Post by maze-le »

iribe wrote: post #187
sukilot wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The PD actually usually skips the charges. It is literally highway robbery: trooper pulls over a car, searches it, takes the money.

This is no different than paying bribes to third world police.

In fact it is...

I've been to Geogia, in the Caucasus-Mountains, not the southern US-State. There for example, it is common for Highway-Police to set up checkpoints, and if you are a foreigner, you can be sure to pay them some bucks, 25$, 50$, 100$ somewhere in that dimension. To be sure, this is 'illegal'... No one cares to stop the police from doing that though, but it is still illegal.

It is something entireley different, to always assume your car can be searched and all your cash can be stripped from you 'legally'....

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#214

Post by notahacker »

itistoday2 wrote: post #207
Frondo wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are free to move to another country. The fact that no other country meets your very specific requirements doesn't mean that you are not obligated to pay for living in this one. If no automobile maker will sell you the exact car you want, that does not grant you the right to take a car without paying for it. So, yes, you do agree to pay these taxes by continuing to live here.

> You are free to move to another country. Please explain how I can do that. I would actually like to move to Switzerland, could you explain how I can freely do that as everything I've researched indicates it's neither free nor possible in any reasonable amount of time. If not Switzerland I'll settle for some other country where I can live freely and be safe from coercion. > If no automobile maker will sell you the e…

If you live someplace and don't pay rent at the end of the month, the landlord will bill you, even if you're desperately searching for somewhere else.

For some reason, most anti-taxers consider this not to be "coercion" but to be an efficient way of allocating resources and will defend to the death the landlord's right to demand that I compensate him for occupying a particular location he has a prior claim over. The rationale behind treating private territorial claims on my wealth more favourably than public ones continues to elude me...

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#216

Post by Frondo »

itistoday2 wrote: post #211
Frondo wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can leave the U.S. whenever you want. The U.S. isn't restricting your ability to leave. If the country of your choice doesn't permit you to emigrate, that doesn't mean that you're suddenly free from your obligations to whatever country will host you. Wouldn't that be convenient? "Sir, I don't have to pay taxes. I want to move to Switzerland, but they're full right now, so I can't." (And the "threat of prison" is…

It doesn't help if all other countries both severely restrict entry and/or force a tax upon you. I'd just end up in the same exact situation. > And the "threat of prison" is some of the dumbest hyperbole... It's not hyperbole. If you willfully fail to file that's grounds for imprisonment: http://www.businessinsider.com/terrible-things-that-could-ha... You're probably thinking of cases when people "forget" or make "mi…

Fine, you're not antitax. You're just engaging in a lengthy thread debate using their common arguments. I stand by my statement w.r.t. the antitax crowd.

And again, whether all other countries do not meet your preference or requirement does not free you from your obligations to this one, as long as you live here.

Whether other countries don't allow you in, don't allow you to stay, don't govern the way you like, or whatever other complaint you may have about other countries, that does not change your present-day relationship to this one: that you live here, and as such are obligated to pay taxes as long as you do.

And of course there are, right now, many other countries that you could emigrate to if you liked. Even if your A-list countries aren't open, you still have lots of options.

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#217

Post by philh »

Frondo wrote: post #201
titanomachy wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If taxation today is theft, is there a time when it wasn't?

Taxation isn't theft. The anti-tax crowd is just like the anti-vax crowd. They both want a free ride on the rest of our backs; the anti-vaxers want the benefit of herd immunity, and the anti-taxers want others to pay the cost of living in the modern world. (*edited to a missing word)

Anti-tax is about not forcing people to pay for services they may not want. I don't think it's realistic, but your description of them is uncharitable.

In a world where everyone gets hit on the head with a baseball bat once a week, some people are saying "what's with this? Can't we figure out some way of not getting hit by baseball bats every week?" And you're turning that into "I don't want to get hit by a baseball bat, someone else should get hit instead of me".

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#218

Post by itistoday2 »

notahacker wrote: post #214
itistoday2 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are free to move to another country. Please explain how I can do that. I would actually like to move to Switzerland, could you explain how I can freely do that as everything I've researched indicates it's neither free nor possible in any reasonable amount of time. If not Switzerland I'll settle for some other country where I can live freely and be safe from coercion. > If no automobile maker will sell you the e…

If you live someplace and don't pay rent at the end of the month, the landlord will bill you, even if you're desperately searching for somewhere else. For some reason, most anti-taxers consider this not to be "coercion" but to be an efficient way of allocating resources and will defend to the death the landlord's right to demand that I compensate him for occupying a particular location he has a prior claim over. The…

One involves non-coercive mutual consent (a signed agreement), the other doesn't.

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#219

Post by bcook »

sumedh wrote: post #162
aliakhtar wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, or why withdraw it in cash at all? It could be kept in the bank and a debit card used to withdraw it.

> or why withdraw it in cash at all? Its my money, I can do whatever I want.

When I bought my first vehicle, friends and family told me to get a cashier's check and not carry a large sum of cash across state lines, for a few reasons.

Yes, I had the right to do otherwise, but without a logical reason to do so, why?

I am honestly wondering if there are any good reasons to carry cash like that. Ignorance, perhaps.

Re: How the DEA took a young man’s life savings without charging him with a crime

#220

Post by Frondo »

itistoday2 wrote: post #218
notahacker wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you live someplace and don't pay rent at the end of the month, the landlord will bill you, even if you're desperately searching for somewhere else. For some reason, most anti-taxers consider this not to be "coercion" but to be an efficient way of allocating resources and will defend to the death the landlord's right to demand that I compensate him for occupying a particular location he has a prior claim over. The…

One involves non-coercive mutual consent (a signed agreement), the other doesn't.

You do give consent by continuing to live here past the age of maturity.

When you're a child, and your parents have custody of you, they make that choice for you--you're a citizen here, here's where you'll live, be politically involved, and pay taxes.

When you're old enough to make that choice for yourself, that's when you can stay--with all that entails--or go.

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