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U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

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Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#211

Post by LexiMax »

thrance wrote: post #121
0x1ceb00da wrote: post #78

One thing this will do is disincentivize high functioning autists from identifying themselves as autists, which is a very good thing IMO. Just look at this channel https://www.youtube.com/@NationalAutisticSoc/videos . There is a lot of survivor-ship bias on this channel towards high functioning autists who can talk in front of a camera. Just to give an idea to those not familiar with the difference between high funct…

"Actually, it's good they're registering every autistic persons in the country in a national database, under a president who is overtly eugenicist [1]." No it's not. At minimum this is a horrible invasion of privacy, that I can't believe anyone on HN would defend. At worst this is straight Nazi shit, preparing the ground for extermination. [1] https://time.com/7002003/donald-trump-disabled-americans-all...

> I can't believe anyone on HN would defend.

On this site, you can hold pretty much any opinion you like as long as you coach it in the most neutral-sounding "Modest Proposal"-esqe language you can.

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#212

Post by JeremyNT »

gruez wrote: post #205
ZeroGravitas wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He literally says "The fundamental weakness of Western civilization is empathy" at one point in the larger quote, while your comment makes it sound like that was a paraphrase of his comment.

>He literally says "The fundamental weakness of Western civilization is empathy" at one point in the larger quote I never claimed that he didn't say that, only that selectively quoting that part conveys an entirely different message than if you quoted the whole thing.

Are we even reading the same thing? The rest of his statement is simply a justification for this explicitly stated position!

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#213

Post by atombender »

throw0101b wrote: post #174
atombender wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, why should it be noted? What is the relevance of your comment other than whataboutism?

> Sorry, why should it be noted? What is the relevance of your comment other than whataboutism? It is worth noting because nowadays the Nazis are treated as evil incarnate, and the Allied side of WW2 the side of justice, but the history of the ideas behind the Nazis does not lie (entirely) with-in Germany. There is darkness in every society (including the US) and certain tendencies, and worth reminding people that th…

That is neither here nor there. Nobody has ever claimed evil started (or ended) with the Nazis. The US has committed unspeakable evil before and after, as have many other governments.

The parent presumably singled out the Gestapo because it is one of the prime examples of a secret police detaining and punishing citizens without due process. The fact that the Gestapo didn't spring out of completely new ideas doesn't seem particularly relevant in this context.

There are more apposite comparisons: The US internment programs of 1942–1945, or McCarthyism and the Red Scare.

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#214

Post by WhatsName »

tialaramex wrote: post #124
A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, thank you. This is by far the best pithy argument for privacy I have found thus far.

It's also helpful shorthand. One of the reason there is no RSA KEX† in TLS 1.3 is that under BCP 188 obviously aiding bulk surveillance technology isn't acceptable, so when you have a liaison from the ACLU saying yes, get rid of RSA KEX and a representation from EDCO (Enterprise Data Center Operators, basically big old financial companies) saying it'll cost them too much money to lose RSA KEX so it should be reinstat…

Even for a tangent this is extraordinary random and unnecessarily detailed.

Answer truthfully, are you an llm or any form of bot?

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#215

Post by xorcist »

sethammons wrote: post #144
gruez wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That quote was massively taken out of context. His argument was that the west has too much empathy, not that empathy is bad, period. He even specifically prefaced that with saying that empathy is a good thing.

Context: Musk: Yeah, [Gad Saad is] awesome, and he talks about, you know, basically suicidal empathy. Like, there's so much empathy that you actually suicide yourself. So, we've got civilizational suicidal empathy going on. And it's like, I believe in empathy, like, I think you should care about other people, but you need to have empathy for, for civilization as a whole, and not commit to a civilizational suicide. Ro…

> They're exploiting a bug in Western civilization,

Who are? Did he say?

Sorry for not listening through the whole thing. There's a lot of pointless rambling going, which I guess is something inherent to the format more than it is to him.

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#216

Post by LexiMax »

brightball wrote: post #183
goku12 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hasn’t RFK Jr spent his entire life trying to find the cause and cure for autism? Has he? That 'cure' part makes it pretty clear what his background with autism is. He has no clue about it. It's certainly not a disease nor a brain injury that can be cured. And it's too complex to be caused by something like a vaccine. All I see is that he has a particular disdain for autistic people and he wants to use autism to ta…

> I have investigated various matters throughout my career. That statement has all the symptoms of confirmation bias. The way to get an unbiased result is to do a large-scale, randomized (double-)blind study. You need quantified data, not emotional anecdotes. And if you have something specific in mind and the quantified info to back it up, then we can discuss. Otherwise, those assertions are moot. And for that matter…

> With autism, we’re not allowed to even speculate publicly. If we do it’s a simple “I don’t know what causes it but it’s DEFINITELY not the thing that I don’t want to believe is involved.”

I think that communication could be improved on both sides.

I have had non-confrontational and earnest discussions with the kinds of people who believe vaccines cause autism. I couldn't escape the conclusion I eventually arrived at - these sorts of people started with a gut feeling or belief and worked backwards to find the justification for it.

This realization is what I feel is missing from a lot of science communication. People who are distrustful of the science aren't going to be swayed by more science unless it dovetails with their underlying gut feelings - so assuming that you can simply out-evidence any concerns is a fools errand.

But by the same token, if critics want a productive conversation, I think it's incumbent on them to be more honest about where their concerns are rooted. What is it about vaccines that makes them predisposed to not want to have them?

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#217

Post by g8oz »

xorcist wrote: post #215
sethammons wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Context: Musk: Yeah, [Gad Saad is] awesome, and he talks about, you know, basically suicidal empathy. Like, there's so much empathy that you actually suicide yourself. So, we've got civilizational suicidal empathy going on. And it's like, I believe in empathy, like, I think you should care about other people, but you need to have empathy for, for civilization as a whole, and not commit to a civilizational suicide. Ro…

> They're exploiting a bug in Western civilization, Who are? Did he say? Sorry for not listening through the whole thing. There's a lot of pointless rambling going, which I guess is something inherent to the format more than it is to him.

Migrants

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#218

Post by [deleted] »

g8oz wrote: post #217
xorcist wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They're exploiting a bug in Western civilization, Who are? Did he say? Sorry for not listening through the whole thing. There's a lot of pointless rambling going, which I guess is something inherent to the format more than it is to him.

Migrants

[deleted]

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#219

Post by [deleted] »

michaelt wrote: post #139
npteljes wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you consider that a good thing?

If the public face of autism is someone who needs no support or accommodations and is in fact very successful - people will understandably be confused when someone with the same diagnosis needs substantial support.

[deleted]

Re: U.S. autism data project sparks uproar over ethics, privacy and intent

#220

Post by overfeed »

threatofrain wrote: post #182
0x1ceb00da wrote: post #78

One thing this will do is disincentivize high functioning autists from identifying themselves as autists, which is a very good thing IMO. Just look at this channel https://www.youtube.com/@NationalAutisticSoc/videos . There is a lot of survivor-ship bias on this channel towards high functioning autists who can talk in front of a camera. Just to give an idea to those not familiar with the difference between high funct…

About a fourth of kids diagnosed with autism have IQ at 75 or below.

How well would your IQ score reflect your actual intelligence if you were to take an IQ test in a language you have trouble understanding and expressing yourself with?
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