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Why are debut novels failing to launch?

esquire.com

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Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#211

Post by nothercastle »

boznz wrote: post #4

Spent several years writing and editing my first book before thinking the job was finished when I hit the publish now button. But it is literally only half the job done. The hell now is unless you get friends and family or an agency involved to push it and market it it will languish on the 500th page of any Amazon search forever. Oh and did I say that there are thousands of books a day released and there is nowhere y…

Why write a book as your first attempt? It seems like you would need to write a bunch of short stories and establish a name for yourself before anyone would commit to reading your book.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#212

Post by ghaff »

WalterBright wrote: post #92
bane wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I could describe the near physical pain I feel that "Rendezvous with Rama" isn't yet a great Denise Villeneuve movie, and the "Night's Dawn Trilogy" isn't yet a multi-season series on Apple TV. The list goes on.

I've had enough of the Dune remakes, too. The world doesn't need more Planet That Went Ape remakes, either. The Mote in God's Eye would make a fine miniseries.

In fairness, IMO the latest Dune(s) were the first that weren't deeply flawed. I do agree that The Mote in God's Eye--and perhaps associated shorts would make a fine basis for a series--hopefully one that ignored the sequels.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#213

Post by bryanrasmussen »

joenot443 wrote: post #149
bryanrasmussen wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, I seem to get the same result on things I post from my medium publication - which started after I posted some links to some time travel stories I wrote in a post about time travel which seemed to me to relate and which got a few upvotes. After that if I posted a link to an article I wrote it got shadow blocked (at least for a bit) the thing is I only post things here that I think fit the site, which is about 1…

Lots of people submit their own work to HN all the time to great success. If your post was flagged, it probably just wasn’t as relevant to the community as you might have imagined. Perhaps take it as constructive criticism on your writing, rather than blaming the poor reception on the community.

so I wrote

>After that if I posted a link to an article I wrote it got shadow blocked

and you responded

>If your post was flagged

please take that as constructive criticism (explanation if you don't get my point: I did not use the word "flagged")

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#214

Post by stocknoob »

frutiger wrote: post #135
hi-v-rocknroll wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Don't expect anyone to read what you wrote, much less commercial success, unless you were a Harvard undergrad English prodigy who joined Penguin publishing, or somehow wiggled into the circle of [City] Review of [Each Others'] Books. It's a one-way, time-traveling message in a bottle comprised of dead trees. Doing it for art is a wolf's howl that it lived and that it could. Although, it's gradually shifted i…

> It's a one-way, time-traveling message in a bottle So too is DNA in children. You don’t get to choose the entirety of the message but you do get to choose the half of the lottery that they must receive. And that message is likely to far outlive any message in any dead tree or electronic book.

After 10 generations your message is diluted to 0.1%.

We still read Shakespeare and listen to Mozart.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#215

Post by ghaff »

nothercastle wrote: post #211
boznz wrote: post #4

Spent several years writing and editing my first book before thinking the job was finished when I hit the publish now button. But it is literally only half the job done. The hell now is unless you get friends and family or an agency involved to push it and market it it will languish on the 500th page of any Amazon search forever. Oh and did I say that there are thousands of books a day released and there is nowhere y…

Why write a book as your first attempt? It seems like you would need to write a bunch of short stories and establish a name for yourself before anyone would commit to reading your book.

Not that you'll probably make money in any case but there's very little in the way of routes to market where short stories have even a hope of making beer money. This is even true of genres like SF that at least to have reasonable short story magazines as an entry point.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#216

Post by ghaff »

pjlegato wrote: post #209
spondylosaurus wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trusted (human) reviewers and critics are more important than ever to me. Like you said, lists of whatever's popular or trending are just... things that are trending. For good reasons or otherwise. Meanwhile if I read a Richard Brody review I get a sense of whether a movie might be worth watching—even though we don't have identical taste, I've learned a lot about his, and now I know how his taste translates into revi…

The problem with that arrangement is that it doesn't scale: a tiny number of popular critics become the gatekeepers. Success in the field then depends entirely on somehow gaining the notice -- and good reviews -- of one of these few critics. Countless other pieces of art are never noticed by anyone, countless talented artists are forced into day jobs and eventually abandon art -- no matter how high quality (for whate…

Back in the day there were some movie critics who I felt I could generally rely on, some I either mostly aligned with or realized we had different tastes in specific ways, and a few who I could reliably count on to be a counter-indication of what I would like.

But it may be a reflection of the modern media landscape but I don't have critics that I gravitate to any longer. Admittedly I couldn't even name the critics at publications I actually subscribe to.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#217

Post by atombender »

jimbokun wrote: post #17
boznz wrote: post #4

Spent several years writing and editing my first book before thinking the job was finished when I hit the publish now button. But it is literally only half the job done. The hell now is unless you get friends and family or an agency involved to push it and market it it will languish on the 500th page of any Amazon search forever. Oh and did I say that there are thousands of books a day released and there is nowhere y…

I don't understand why Hacker News and Reddit block self promotion. "Hey, look at a thing I made!" is a lot more interesting than a lot of the other drivel that gets posted.

As a Reddit mod, I block most self-promotion because honestly it's mostly trash posted by people with no interest in the community.

These posts are almost always of low quality and designed to hook gullible people, and much of it driven either by influencers or sellers of snake oil. It's not just legit promotional posts, either; there's plenty of astroturfing trying to post recommendations for products etc. Even so I bet a lot goes under my radar.

In a very few cases I have allowed a promotional post when I have been convinced that it was for a good purpose. I support genuine entrepreneurs who look like they're building something of value. But those are extremely rare on Reddit. All of Reddit is rather bleak in that regard. So much content stealing, influencing, astroturfing, link farming, and outright spam.

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#218

Post by richardatlarge »

mikemitchelldev wrote: post #157

A debut novel that's not published is not necessarily a wasted effort. It can be adapted into a screenplay, which can be submitted to a variety of outlets, and the novel might be published later if successful.

Almost never happens; legal issues keep unsolicited screenplay submissions to zero

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#219

Post by richardatlarge »

medion wrote: post #26

Publishers only want to publish authors with large social followings. The first question they ask is a list of your socials.

False: never had any publisher ask my agent about this, although no doubt it can be a factor if you have a huge following

Re: Why are debut novels failing to launch?

#220

Post by richardatlarge »

_tom_ wrote: post #119
surfingdino wrote: post #9

The market is dominated by large publishers. They do not need to compete, they have already won. At the same time, they don't want to loose the marketshare, which makes them less likely to bet on an unknown author.

The market is dominated by ebooks. Trad publishing gets a few home runs, but overall can't compete with the sheer volume of new independent books that come out each year.

Supporting evidence?
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