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Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

latimes.com

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Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#211

Post by sparker72678 »

ditonal wrote: post #170
bradleyjg wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even leaving aside golden handcuffs the number of companies paying top of market seems relatively small. That’s especially true once you get past entry level positions.

I feel the opposite. A decade ago, it was pretty much Google, Facebook, and some elite trading firms that could pay a ton. Now so many startups have grown up, there’s a huge list of them on levels.FYI that will pay 400k+ for senior and 600k+ for staff. I recently have interviewed for a ton and got rejected a bunch, but I joked with my spouse that there’s so many that by the time you’re done interviewing at all of the…

Omg I need to up my reqs in my interviews.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#212

Post by ketzo »

tcbumperino wrote: post #83

Once you’re coasting in the 400-500k FAANG range, what’s the optimal move to get 700-800k+? Seems there are too many graybeards to get a Principal title. Better to switch to manager role? Or VP eng type at some startup and hope your stock hits? Or maybe VP at some non tech company?

If the primary goal is compensation, management is pretty much always gonna be the answer; that, or lots of very lucky equity.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#213

Post by echelon »

thr1236 wrote: post #193

Hard to know what is a good or high total comp in the current market. I’m at $175k in central FL. I see a lot of people posting much higher pay on various forums and I often wonder if I’m underpaid. Now more than ever. Outside of FAANG (and similar) I’ve only found companies paying around ~200k total for senior level engineers. These places still have rigorous interviews but not quite FAANG difficulty. Still, the mot…

> I’m at $175k in central FL.

For total comp that's really low. I'd expect that to be paired with RSU equity grants of $150 - $200k/yr.

Any publicly listed "tech company" that isn't penny pinching like Amazon will probably offer similar rates.

Maybe look for a tech company that is hiring remote? Negotiate a good total comp package if it isn't in line with what you see on glassdoor, etc.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#214

Post by gavinray »

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #195
tcbumperino wrote: post #83

Once you’re coasting in the 400-500k FAANG range, what’s the optimal move to get 700-800k+? Seems there are too many graybeards to get a Principal title. Better to switch to manager role? Or VP eng type at some startup and hope your stock hits? Or maybe VP at some non tech company?

I told myself I'd be fine at 300k. Now I'm there, and I've picked up more hobbies. Doesn't stop me from looking for new gigs, from time to time. Going super deep into optimizing for one thing might be a good short-term, but bad long-term proposition. A lot of getting to 700k, I imagine, is luck. So long as you're competent, it's right place, right time. You can't force that situation to happen, so it's wasted energy…

You would abandon your company and current position for a slight pay increase?

Do you not actually care about the company you work for and you're just there for the pay?

You make so much money already -- what is the thought process here

Man imagine trying to hire people and knowing they would all leave in a heartbeat for a slight pay increase.

What ever happened to working somewhere because you believe in what you're building and the people you're around bring you joy?

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#216

Post by rubicon33 »

mmaunder wrote: post #141
dbish wrote: post #4

Even if you think you’re well paid, now is the time to look around. I’ve had a lot of friends, mentees, and coworkers get huge bumps on total compensation even as relatively senior engineers and managers. Pay is jumping and companies aren’t doing a great job keeping that up for their people who have been around for a few years. As an employer, that should be the top worry, keep comp up, don’t lose your people because…

Exactly this. We just gave all our devs a significant raise - way above the norm, and way way earlier than we would. We're acknowledging the reality of demand, scarcity and wage inflation. My co-founder (also my wife) and I immediately felt our blood pressure drop once we did that. Market conditions are making it hard to retain and very hard to hire. We've done a bunch of other stuff to recruit - which I described in…

Kudos for doing the right thing. I hope (and expect) that for you and your business, it is the right thing. Hopefully those devs are quite skilled, and worth keeping around, and will stay and help the business grow! I feel like a lot of times employers think devs are expendable, and while that's true to some extent, devs also can be quite worth paying extra to keep around especially if they've accrued quite a lot of domain knowledge that pertains to your business.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#217

Post by echelon »

lima wrote: post #139
version_five wrote: post #63

An interesting corollary is that certain types of business are no longer economically viable. If I have a business that competes with advertising companies for niche talent, my business model has to be able to generate the same outsized returns on that talent if I want to be able to afford them, so this limits the work I can do. I don't think people should work for below market wages, only observing how it can change…

Many people are indeed willing to work below market wages in exchange for working on something meaningful to them.

Game developers are a classic example. They're paid trash salaries and treated like vermin.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#218

Post by sirmike_ »

the_only_law wrote: post #100

I hate that the market is so great right now because I really can’t take advantage of it. I would love to start the process, to try and get a salary increase anywhere from 30%-100% but unfortunately I’ve stagnated sharply skills wise. Don’t qualify for the jobs I see I think I’d enjoy, and don’t even qualify for the jobs that meet my salary preferences that I’d otherwise dislike. I also would have to be looking at im…

Why are you saying crazy self-fulfilling prophesies? Do you hate money?

Take the leap into something you WANT. Skills, Sschmills! You can learn can't you? Life means learning new stuff all the time. Learning never takes a time out.

The military was a bastion of learned lessons for me. One key takeaway: You are your own best advocate. Everything in an interview or negotiation related to you springs from that viewpoint. That's one of the most basic you will repeat infinitely. Use it boldly, not arrogantly.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#219

Post by noleetcode »

dbish wrote: post #4

Even if you think you’re well paid, now is the time to look around. I’ve had a lot of friends, mentees, and coworkers get huge bumps on total compensation even as relatively senior engineers and managers. Pay is jumping and companies aren’t doing a great job keeping that up for their people who have been around for a few years. As an employer, that should be the top worry, keep comp up, don’t lose your people because…

I'd love to, as I'm really tired of my current employer, and they're definitely taking advantage of me, but I resolved to never waste my time with leetcode garbage again... which means I either stay where I'm at, or exit the industry entirely.

Re: Employers bow to tech workers in hottest job market since the dot-com era

#220

Post by lostcolony »

JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #169
lr4444lr wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think just the opposite: the best time to pounce on them with salary expectations is as late as possible, after they've already invested the interview time on you and seen you excel.

If they already have their budget in mind before the interview process began, it won't buy you any leverage waiting until the very end. They won't care that they burnt the money/time/energy considering your candidacy, even if that costs them more in the long run. I've ended up wasting a lot of my own time with this strategy. I'll get to the point where they want to extend an offer, I name my number, and then we have…

"If they already have their budget in mind before the interview process began"

This is impossible to know though, as is its breakdown. Many places have very fixed limits on salary and bonus, for instance, but RSUs and sign on they have a lot of freedom.

Even the places that have fixed budgets all around may have multiple openings of varying levels; a strong interview showing may cause them to bump the level they'd look to hire you at, just to meet your comp expectations (I've seen this happen numerous times as a manager when a candidate came back asking for more).

If they bring it up at the start, great, it saves a lot of time for both of you. If -you- bring it up at the start, though, you're just closing off opportunities.

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