Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wow, that takes customer tracking to a whole new level.
Tracking items you bought?
Yes, and your phone and all its identifying data, and exactly when you went to each part of the store.
The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
211–220 of 231 posts
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wow, that takes customer tracking to a whole new level.
Doubt it's any different than membership cards.
Those don't track you around the store, or profile you for personalised advertising, or connect your purchases to online behaviour, or even necessarily identify you (I never filled in the contact details for mine, just use the number to get the discounts).
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you have a source that retail companies follow economic theory versus profit maximization? In a capitalist system, companies try to maximize profit. They usually go into cartel or copycat mode doing the least they can to compete and increase profit. One thing many do is have a self-checkout to cut labor while otherwise running the same way. In the real world, that means the prices and level of service will be the…
These are publicly traded companies. We do not need to guess what they are doing. Walmart has a profit margin of 1.62% https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/WMT/walmart/net-pr... Target: 3.96% https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/TGT/target/net-pro... BJs: 1.13% https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/BJ/bjs-wholesale-c... For reference: Alphabet: 19.71% https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/GOOG/alpha…
That doesn't tell you anything for two reasons: missed profit by mismanagement and operating vs net profit. Especially those companies.
First one. I have friends that work at every retailer you named. Every one of them intentionally leaves stuff empty on the shelf to get workers to do side jobs, esp displays, reports, abd various meetings. Walmart and Target start throwing money away towards the afternoon after they're mostly stocked. Kroger starts leaving stuff empty in the morning to do scans or "walks" as employees describe them. None of these intentional losses are in their annual reports or the media. Latter being because they're big customers of media.
Second part. The percentages you quoted are whats left after all their big spending. For instance, both Walmart and Kroger in my area are doing million dollar remodels. Although some are welcome, many changes are just moving shit around. Customers wouldve kept shopping regardless. So, that easily couldve stayed in final profit. They often give executives raises in 6-7 digit range. They have way more managers in stores and offices than Publix which is more profitable. Also, local Kroger uninstalled some registers and added more self-checkouts despite their profit going up just before that. Obviously, the two weren't connected.
So, the operating profit vs justifiable expenses is what to look at along with management practices which you get surveying employees. When management is bullshitting, the employees are often more than happy to tell you about it if you seem sympathetic and esp have your own stories. Once I knew it was intentional, I almost entirely boycotted Walmart and Kroger with me going to companies like Costco, Aldi and Piggly Wiggly who still stock shelves. Piggly Wiggly and Trader Joe's also still have plenty of checkers/baggers despite "tough market conditions" others report. And that Piggly Wiggly is in one of most cut-throat areas price-wise. Talking $0.89-0.99 cent gallons of milk at all stores at times with Aldi dropping eggs to $0.28. Fresh Market straight-up canceled their store mid-construction seeing how rough it was.
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
Alternatively, it's revealing a deeper truth that had been obscured by a long chain of seemingly logical justifications. Corporations tend to abuse abstractions until they break, and self-checkout is basically at that breaking point. Comedy is especially good at deflating bullshit like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxINJzqzn4w I for one could never stand the things for their slow and obtuse programming. I can…
So you admit openly to stealing, just to put it plainly. You chose to shop somewhere, you chose to use a self checkout, you knew there was an error, and proceeded to leave with things you didn’t pay for. No matter how you justify it to yourself, you’re a thief. If you can justify that you can justify stealing from your employer (hey I’ve been under paid for a while, taking this unsecured device is like making up for…
I find the logic here really interesting. When you participate in a buy-one-get-one-free offer, you "leave with things you didn't pay for". So imagine these scenarios:
You go to a greengrocers. The lady at the checkout sees you basket of 27 grapefruit and can't be bothered to do the maths, says "let's call it 5 [relevant currency]". You know you have something in the region of 7 relevant currency, but she insists she won't take a button more.
You go to the supermarket. The tills are misconfigured, a 10[currency] box of chocolates is coming up as 0.1[currency] [1]. You're buying 5 of them. The cashier has no facility to charge you more - whatever the system says is a divine edict as far as the company is concerned.
You go to the supermarket. You're walking by the main doors with your trolley when a fire alarm goes off; smoke is billowing from the back of the store, sprinklers are activated. In the blind panic, you - and your trolley - are pushed outside. After half an hour, they announce that the store will not be reopening. You tell security that you have not paid for your shopping, they gruffly request that you take it home and make use of it rather than litter the car park with rapidly defrosting frozen items, as nobody is allowed back in the building.
In most of these cases, you could probably pay the correct amount by queueing at another till, at another time, date, at your own time and cost. For the benefit of someone who doesn't care enough about the profit margin to worry.
These are much closer than your employer-theft analogy - I don't think that the parent poster's moral standpoint is at all far away from any of the above. In fact, the only difference is that because it's a technical "glitch" with no humans involved, you clearly feel you're supposed to go the extra mile to rectify the seller's mistakes, caused by the seller failing to invest sufficiently in the system.
I certainly wouldn't judge someone making any of these calls, regardless whether I personally would go that extra thankless mile.
[1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/money-sa...
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
So you admit openly to stealing, just to put it plainly. You chose to shop somewhere, you chose to use a self checkout, you knew there was an error, and proceeded to leave with things you didn’t pay for. No matter how you justify it to yourself, you’re a thief. If you can justify that you can justify stealing from your employer (hey I’ve been under paid for a while, taking this unsecured device is like making up for…
I find the logic here really interesting. When you participate in a buy-one-get-one-free offer, you "leave with things you didn't pay for". So imagine these scenarios: You go to a greengrocers. The lady at the checkout sees you basket of 27 grapefruit and can't be bothered to do the maths, says "let's call it 5 [relevant currency]". You know you have something in the region of 7 relevant currency, but she insists she…
I think the closest, albeit boring, analogy to the situation is you go through the traditional staffed register at a busy time. The tally comes out a little lower than you were expecting. Since it's not higher, you pay and get out of the way. In the parking lot, you look over your receipt and see that one item out of many didn't get scanned. Now you have the choice of either just accepting the benefit from the mistake, or spending your life waiting in line again simply to redo their job better than they did it themselves. IMO it's foolish to correct their mistake by harming yourself instead.
I've also corrected cashiers on the spot, especially for more significant errors. I once had a cashier ring up a manual 20% off coupon as 80% off ($20 vs $80 final price). Going through with that transaction could reasonably be called dishonest, despite it being perfectly legal.
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
Groceries are the most low margin retail business at 1-2 percent. So the cost savings have definitely been passed on to the customer, unless you can find figures to the contrary.
By "the cost savings have been passed on to the customer", do you mean that a) self-checkout has caused the customer to pay more for groceries, or that b) the cost of groceries has remained the same (or decreased), but now the store makes extra profits from it because they don't have to pay as many clerks? If b) then we're back to where I started: you might as well complain about the discount on Swiss cheese. You don…
Neither a nor b.
Take the wholesale price of the product, add rent, delivery, payment processing, in store labour and all the other expenses involved in running a store, then add 1-2%. That gives you the price you pay in store. That formula hasn't changed since self checkout was introduced, but the cost figures have changed.
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
It doesn't. It just increases their profit. What they charge is determined by different people in those organizations. Most vendors have cashiers in Mid-South. Walmart and Kroger are the ones adding lots of self-checkouts with Walmart being about charging less with low service and Kroger charging more with a bit more service. Dollar General and Aldi are cheapest with no self-checkout, but less cashiers. So, there's y…
> It doesn't. It just increases their profit. this isn't a self-evident claim. if you have other large competitors who operate in the same market space (for walmart and target, large stores selling a mix of well-known brands and discount store brands), and there is a cost-cutting technique that's available to all participants, it's really hard to employ it and keep all the surplus for yourself. this is especially tru…
Your argument makes the common mistake to look at these companies as abstract entities competing based on economic theory instead of groups of humans doing what humans do in businesses. In most cases, the decisions come from middle management that operate based on a mix of competition and what gets them a bonus. Cutting costs or increasing profit within a manager's personal area of responsibility is often a bonus (or promotion) metric. So, many of them keep damaging their own companies to try to get their bonus or promotion. Such companies usually have endless discussions, meetings, and politicking where they explain away their bullshit hoping it will work.
This should be a factor in every discussion of why companies are doing what they're doing. Will the CEO or any managers doing it get an easier bonus or transition for it with minimal liability within whatever period they're working? Well, there you go. That's economic self-interest in the real world.
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
Isn't life too short for spending several hours to make pasta lol lol
I said couple , not several ! My partner is of half-Italian background, and today was the first time she used the chitarra [1] she recently received as a gift from her family. So yep, making the dough, waiting for it to rise, making the sauce, then pushing the dough through the chitarra to make the spaghetti all takes a bit of time. It's not an every-day thing, but as a couple's thing to do on a quiet Sunday afternoo…
It sounds like you're living the life, man. I apologize if I goaded you into an unproductive argument; sometimes I get like that. Cheers.
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
If Amazon is not held accountable for fraudulent business practices, is it ethical to hold a shoplifter accountable? The answer, in my mind, is that it is not only not ethical to do so, but it is grossly unethical to do so.
It's not fair but we shouldn't conflate the judgement of other's actions with choosing how we ourselves act. If Amazon is not held accountable for fraudulent business practices should I then steal? No. They've no relevance to each other, I am responsible for my actions.
Maybe you should steal, and still be responsible for your actions or inaction (I am not recommending this). If you consider them evil, then sabotage is justifiable.
Do we have an objective set of morals that are above the law? Was the Soviet government evil? What about any corporation that is not carbon negative?
Re: The Banana Trick and Other Acts of Self-Checkout Thievery (2018)
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
I said couple , not several ! My partner is of half-Italian background, and today was the first time she used the chitarra [1] she recently received as a gift from her family. So yep, making the dough, waiting for it to rise, making the sauce, then pushing the dough through the chitarra to make the spaghetti all takes a bit of time. It's not an every-day thing, but as a couple's thing to do on a quiet Sunday afternoo…
It sounds like you're living the life, man. I apologize if I goaded you into an unproductive argument; sometimes I get like that. Cheers.
Thanks for the kind comment. I did still learn a thing or two from the discussion so thanks for your part in that too :)