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Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

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Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#211

Post by rconti »

yumraj wrote: post #134
Klathmon wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think so. Tesla is like Apple in a way. They are both the "Brand name" and the "technology" all in one package, and splitting the 2 would lead to each one being significantly less than half their total. Personally I think what would be best for Tesla (in a vacuum) is if they stopped trying to grow so quickly, and grew much like the other car manufacturers did, over a longer period of time, so that missteps an…

If we follow your analogy, Apple provides both hardware and software value. In the case of Tesla, IMHO, the value is mostly hardware as in the core technology, not, IMHO, in the car/controls/screen/ that they put around. Again, as a thought experiment: Would customers not like a Mercedes/BMW/Lexus/Audi/Jag... with Tesla battery/drivetrain/superchargers but in a Mercedes/BMW/Lexus/Audi/Jag... car shell(for lack of a b…

The problem is, it depends on what you mean by "shell". I agree that most Tesla vehicles are fairly spartan from an interior standpoint, but I don't see that to be a drawback. I guess I'm not the target market for a "luxury" car, even though I've got a 3, and I'm also on my 2nd BMW. I simply don't care about butt massagers and cooled seats and chilled glove boxes or whatever we're supposed to mean by "luxury".

I want a quiet, comfortable car. It doesn't need the 7000 buttons that come in a new S-Class today.

But I don't want BMW to take a Model S drivetrain, and put their horrible nav system on it, their keyfobs, their UI. Part of what's so great about the Tesla is that I just walk up to it and get in, and it works. They've rethought enough of the car experience that it's hard for me to draw the line at what I'd want BMW to do.

I guess I'd want BMW... seats? and maybe interior finishes/colors? Maybe? A bit more thought into finishing the trunk? But certainly not just a BMW with a tesla battery and motor.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#212

Post by chronic7s92 »

Dumblydorr wrote: post #27
frontloadpro wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla's market is extremely niche. Luxury car to an uneducated car buyer. Car enthusiasts won't get a Tesla because Tesla's ARE inferior to the competition at that price point. You don't buy a Tesla because you want your car to work for 2 years without breaking, you buy a Tesla to show friends. I know luxury Ford products sold 20k/yr, and those were some seriously high end SUVs. Same price point. I cannot see how Tea…

Teslas are superior, not inferior. It's simple physics, BEV means higher acceleration, lower center of gravity, better cabin volume, quieter, and most importantly: you don't contribute nearly as much to destroying the climate or causing asthma and emphysema in children. How do you counter these basic BEV advantages? Are you in favor of releasing emissions for thousands of years?

> you don't contribute nearly as much to destroying the climate or causing asthma and emphysema in children.

Slow down there.

Not everyone cares about climate change.

The _only_ reason I got a Tesla was for the acceleration and social status. With the Model 3, status has been diluted. Is climate change happening and being accelerated by humans? Yes. Do I care? No. I'm actually selling my P3D and switching to a Porsche 911 because of the Tesla brand dilution.

Disclaimer: I work at Google.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#213

Post by rconti »

bksenior wrote: post #112
yumraj wrote: post #101

I think it's more or less generally agreed that Tesla has the best in class battery, charger and perhaps drive train, including motors, technology. However, they have a single car plant and struggle with production and quality, after sales support and so on. I wonder, as a thought experiment, if Tesla would be more successful if they become the OEM, providing their technology to the various car manufacturers. Somethi…

You think thats bad. Tesla is about to have to head to head with all the majors who are now starting to finally harvest about a decade of their own research in the space (prompted by Teslas early success). Musks ambitions and outbursts strike me as a man who suffers from the top killer of successful entrepreneurs, The skill/talent portability fallacy. It's this idea because you did something similar well, that your a…

I don't disagree, but this reminds me SO much of when I bought my first Mac in 2002 (mind you, I was switching from Linux, not from Windows) and all the nay-sayers were claiming stupid stuff like "MAC doesn't have virus problems because who writes viruses for 2% of the market?" My basic attitude was "I'll enjoy what I've got while I have it."

I've only OWNED a Tesla for 6 months, but man it feels like the other manufacturers have been about to release a Tesla killer Real Soon Like Now for a whooole lot of years. I certainly don't think Tesla's lead is insurmountable, but it sure seems like the competition is doing its best to drop the ball.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#214

Post by minikites »

mythz wrote: post #210
jressey wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then I would just shrug my shoulders and buy more index funds. Investing in individual companies, no matter what you think you know, is always unwise compared to index investing.

My first foray into US shares was in a managed funds which saw me lose 25% of my net worth and they still took their 1.5% fee for their service. I decided I'd rather lose money due to my own decisions and loaded up on AAPL instead which ended up being recouping my losses and then some. I basically limit myself to major tech co's since that's where I see the consolidation of wealth ending up which has proven to be a s…

>in a managed fund

That's different from an index fund.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#215

Post by Domenic_S »

CydeWeys wrote: post #71
frontloadpro wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a Strawman comment, from an uneducated car buyer. There are plenty of higher quality electric vehicles. The acceleration is one tiny aspect of customer satisfaction. Tesla has worst in class interiors and reliability. Not having buttons or trays is something only Tesla can get away with. Is it better for the environment to buy a used car? Or better for the environment to buy a new car?

Just to let you know, you've now called anyone who disagrees with your opinion "uneducated" multiple times. This really rubs me the wrong way. You need to realize that other people have different priorities than you do. Not everyone cares that their car be as luxury as possible. They just want a good electric vehicle, and there's nothing that beats the Model 3 at that price point -- not in range and not in performanc…

FWIW i've owned 3 BMWs and a 2018 Mercedes and I much prefer the seats -- both from a comfort and materials perspective -- in my Model 3 (2nd gen seats).

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#217

Post by jressey »

mythz wrote: post #210
jressey wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then I would just shrug my shoulders and buy more index funds. Investing in individual companies, no matter what you think you know, is always unwise compared to index investing.

My first foray into US shares was in a managed funds which saw me lose 25% of my net worth and they still took their 1.5% fee for their service. I decided I'd rather lose money due to my own decisions and loaded up on AAPL instead which ended up being recouping my losses and then some. I basically limit myself to major tech co's since that's where I see the consolidation of wealth ending up which has proven to be a s…

Managed funds are a ripoff, and not index funds. There is nearly infinite data showing that S&P 500 index funds outperform every single investment strategy.

I would be focusing on bonds indexes right now though, that's just me. Good luck with the lifetime win/loss if you keep this up.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#218

Post by Animats »

They had an order backlog, and they filled it. Now, like the rest of automotive, they're sales-limited. All the big US auto companies have been able to make more than they can sell since 1956. (In the spring of 1956, supply caught up with pent-up WWII demand. Then came the era of chrome.)

Tesla is in a business where many customers just want to pay their money and drive away with a car. Not "preorder" and wait for months. If they get it right, you'll order on line and the car will show up in a few days. The loaner should show up the day you order.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#219

Post by rconti »

frontloadpro wrote: post #18
genie514 wrote: post #8

This figure makes me wonder how other car manufacturers are able to generate demand. Honda alone sells 1m+ cars per year in the US. For all the news, Tesla will likely make 400k deliveries during entire year around the world.

Tesla's market is extremely niche. Luxury car to an uneducated car buyer. Car enthusiasts won't get a Tesla because Tesla's ARE inferior to the competition at that price point. You don't buy a Tesla because you want your car to work for 2 years without breaking, you buy a Tesla to show friends. I know luxury Ford products sold 20k/yr, and those were some seriously high end SUVs. Same price point. I cannot see how Tea…

I'm a car enthusiast, and you're wrong.

Re: Tesla’s First-Quarter Deliveries Plummet

#220

Post by SEJeff »

mythz wrote: post #210
jressey wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then I would just shrug my shoulders and buy more index funds. Investing in individual companies, no matter what you think you know, is always unwise compared to index investing.

My first foray into US shares was in a managed funds which saw me lose 25% of my net worth and they still took their 1.5% fee for their service. I decided I'd rather lose money due to my own decisions and loaded up on AAPL instead which ended up being recouping my losses and then some. I basically limit myself to major tech co's since that's where I see the consolidation of wealth ending up which has proven to be a s…

Index funds track the market index, and aren't managed like a mutual fund. The fees are massively lower. You're comparing apples to lawnmowers here. They aren't the same thing.
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