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GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

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Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#211

Post by arcticbull »

conanbatt wrote: post #181
arcticbull wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fascinating that drugs in Canada are perceived as so much cheaper than in the US, and yet, you know that Canada doesn't have a socialized prescription drug program? Instead, provincial health programs negotiate drug prices. You know who can't do that? Individuals. Also, Medicare.

Purely because of government intervention.. The medicare example is quite an interesting one as well. The US doesn't have the political momentum to let medicare negotiate pharma prices, and before such a basic thing is even changed, you want to hand over the entire health care insurance industry to the government?

Yes. At some point making tiny adjustments to an overwhelmingly backwards and world-leadingly inefficient system is going to be harder than starting fresh.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#213

Post by yardie »

conanbatt wrote: post #100
toomuchtodo wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d still prefer the state over private insurance companies (Medicare is well run and popular). As Steve Jobs said about Dropbox, you’re a feature (insurance companies) not a product.

> I’d still prefer the state over private insurance companies (Medicare is well run and popular). And I vote accordingly. Thats perfectly reasonable, but no need to make a single payer system for that. Just allow medicare to compete in the open market. Thats a much smaller program with a lot less risk. Unfortunately the chances of such a plan to succeed are nil. Thats why big healthcare reform proposals want to stron…

Then the private insurers would be incentivized to recruit healthy patients and dump chronically ill customers into Medicare.

I know this because I’ve already heard HR complain about too many pregnancies in a year caused the company contributions to go up.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#214

Post by astura »

adsadadsad wrote: post #51

GoFundMe is comical, every day there is a new idiot asking for money for not buying (or invalidating) their travel insurance . Little Fred is sitting in hospital now with bills over $xx,xxx due to a motorbike accident whilst backpacking in XYZ, please give generously so Little Fred can keep his iPhoneX and his large family don't have to put their hands in their pocket. e.g. https://www.gofundme.com/injured-by-scooter…

Yep... My original thought was "oh, please."

I hate to be such a negative nancy here but... how many of these are downright scams, that is people lying about being sick, or being sick but lying about the extent of their medical bills, or even people simply being greedy because they have a sob story.

I'm guessing a large percentage, or at least significant.

Call me cold hearted but I just really don't like GoFundMe as a concept. Seems to encourage all life challenges to become chances to collect money. I'm not uncharitable, I just think it breed greed.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#215

Post by Faark »

hippich wrote: post #106
jimrhods23 wrote: post #43

We need to get rid of health insurance companies. They are the reason all of our costs are massively inflated. The same thing is happening in education: universities know that a large percentage of students are getting financial aid, so the true costs are buried in a layer of bureaucracy. Fees and administrative fees continue to go up and the universities will always get their money. The students are then on the hook…

I agree, that in a form current insurance companies exists - i.e. perpaid medical discounts plan, they should be removed. People should be getting insurance from insurable events - i.e. accident, heart attack, etc. Not from routine vaccination, annual checkup, seasonal cold. High-deductible plans are a hack to get people to pay for more of routine stuff and I think it moves into the right direction.

> Not from routine vaccination, annual checkup, seasonal cold.

I feel like you lump in a lot of preventative care in that statement. If your routine checkups / vaccination prevent necessary emergency care and thus save money down the line, not incentivization people to do so seems stupid to me. The insurance company would have to pay for it regardless, unless they manage to cut those cases from the body of their insured. That would feel a lot like preexisting conditions to me...

Having individuals pay for vaccinations also ignores the value of lost herd immunity, due to a prisoners dilemma like situation. But this mean vaccinations have to be provided by insurance. Directly funding it though tax money might be a better option.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#216

Post by jmcqk6 »

hippich wrote: post #96
SequoiaHope wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I’ve been studying a lot on my free time is the deep history of the concept of socialism. Not a particular implementation but the idea that it would be a good idea for us to intentionally build a world where everyone has certain basic needs met by society at large. In particular there is a rich history of “libertarian socialism” which advocates for direct social support of one another without a state. Typic…

My current world view is that socialism implemented via central authority ruling over a very large group (i.e. socialistic government of USSR) is not working, because personal relationships connections are broken when helping each other is outsourced to some abstract entity. It is that entity being praised and hated when someone gets help or someone doesn't. The fact that it is neighbors, other region people, etc act…

This is a very interesting idea. I've been thinking that one of the big problems with government today is that most people do think of it as a 'they' instead of an 'us', but I think the reason is more complex than personal relationships being broken.

At the core, whatever the reason for it, government is not, in fact, a 'they'; it is an 'us.' Many of us insist otherwise, and give many, many different reasons for it, but at it's core government is the mechanism we have for figuring out how to live together.

I don't have proof of this, but I suspect that any other mechanism we come up with is going to inevitably converge towards becoming a government.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#217

Post by SequoiaHope »

akvadrako wrote: post #151
SequoiaHope wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I’ve been studying a lot on my free time is the deep history of the concept of socialism. Not a particular implementation but the idea that it would be a good idea for us to intentionally build a world where everyone has certain basic needs met by society at large. In particular there is a rich history of “libertarian socialism” which advocates for direct social support of one another without a state. Typic…

Most people's gripes about socialism are about central control. That's a vital part of the policies proposed by the left in the USA, especially the Green New Deal. And the worst aspect of Venezuela. "Libertarian socialism" is practically a form of anarchy and has nothing to do with the modern usage. If you want to make it acceptable and frictionless for people to voluntarily offer their services for free, I don't thi…

“Libertarian socialism” in the historical literature is synonymous with “anarchism”, and that is my intended usage. Contrary to popular belief, anarchism is a specific idea for the organization of society that typically advocates for worker control of the means of production, direct democratic control of society, mutual aid between people, care for those that need care (“to each according to their needs”), and disintegration of most of the hierarchies of our current world.

It is difficult to achieve from where we are but by no means impossible. It certainly seems fair and worthwhile, and it is my goal to realize this in the US.

And you’re right! Most people who oppose socialism actually just oppose centralized control, so we have many unknowing allies in the US and that makes it more realistically achievable here.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#218

Post by SequoiaHope »

DFHippie wrote: post #161
akvadrako wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people's gripes about socialism are about central control. That's a vital part of the policies proposed by the left in the USA, especially the Green New Deal. And the worst aspect of Venezuela. "Libertarian socialism" is practically a form of anarchy and has nothing to do with the modern usage. If you want to make it acceptable and frictionless for people to voluntarily offer their services for free, I don't thi…

If someone can figure out how to fix the free rider problem without central control I think everyone would be happy. The problem with the libertarian solution -- purely voluntary charity -- are that a) it is proportional to sympathy rather than need, as many are observing above and b) it amounts to a tax on the generous and a self-reinforcing transfer of economic power and opportunity to the least pro-social members…

Well, there’s libertarians and there’s libertarian socialists, and the latter focus hard on how to solve these problems. I’d say first of all that we haven’t solved these problems under capitalism so we only need to beat what we have, and also that I am a robotics engineer and I believe robotics can be used to provide a basic level of material well being to all members of society and free up people like doctors to see whoever needs care without charging them etc.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#219

Post by TaylorAlexander »

blahblahthrow wrote: post #159
akvadrako wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people's gripes about socialism are about central control. That's a vital part of the policies proposed by the left in the USA, especially the Green New Deal. And the worst aspect of Venezuela. "Libertarian socialism" is practically a form of anarchy and has nothing to do with the modern usage. If you want to make it acceptable and frictionless for people to voluntarily offer their services for free, I don't thi…

Most people's gripes about socialism are senseless whataboutism. "But Venezuela!" Anarchism (or libertarian socialism if you prefer) isn't just about "offering services for free". It's about a lack of hierarchy. You don't have billionaires. Americans today are not ready to embrace anarchism. If you want a good sci-fi novel that explores practically how anarchism could evolve from the current US state, The Dispossesse…

I definitely want to read the Disposessed as it has come up a few times in discussions lately.

I will say that if you devise a system where no one can become a billionaire but you don’t expressly say that, I think a lot of people would in principle support it. If you say people will live and work in one location, they will own that land and the facilities, and they will cooperate to produce output and they have agreed to share the output as needed between their community members, most Americans I think would say they do not oppose you doing that, and many leftists I think would be interested in joining.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#220

Post by darpa_escapee »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #114
ekianjo wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On that note, I find it supremely fucked up that people have to turn to crowdfunding to get their unexpected healthcare costs covered by benevolent internet citizens. So who should pay for it? All taxpayers instead? All countries that have tried that are now in the red. The only good solution, I think, it to work to make healthcare a lot cheaper in the long run.

We all pay for it now , just not necessarily through taxes.

We also pay for it now through taxes: uncollectible medical debt from those who can't afford to pay their medical expenses will be written off at tax time.
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