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GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

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Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#161

Post by DFHippie »

akvadrako wrote: post #151
SequoiaHope wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I’ve been studying a lot on my free time is the deep history of the concept of socialism. Not a particular implementation but the idea that it would be a good idea for us to intentionally build a world where everyone has certain basic needs met by society at large. In particular there is a rich history of “libertarian socialism” which advocates for direct social support of one another without a state. Typic…

Most people's gripes about socialism are about central control. That's a vital part of the policies proposed by the left in the USA, especially the Green New Deal. And the worst aspect of Venezuela. "Libertarian socialism" is practically a form of anarchy and has nothing to do with the modern usage. If you want to make it acceptable and frictionless for people to voluntarily offer their services for free, I don't thi…

If someone can figure out how to fix the free rider problem without central control I think everyone would be happy. The problem with the libertarian solution -- purely voluntary charity -- are that a) it is proportional to sympathy rather than need, as many are observing above and b) it amounts to a tax on the generous and a self-reinforcing transfer of economic power and opportunity to the least pro-social members of society. The latter is the free rider problem. When people look back on the golden age of the 19th century or whenever when charity was voluntary, they're remembering the comfort of the fortunate, not the success of this system at buffering the shocks of misfortune.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#162

Post by ses1984 »

jjeaff wrote: post #89
badfrog wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The show Undercover Boss is kind of like that. Every episode some CEO realizes that all of their employees are underpaid, picks one with an especially sad story, and gives them some money to pay for their kid's surgery or college tuition.

I thought the same thing. And they never seem to come to the realization that maybe a lot of their employees are underpaid. No, it's just the ones with stories that go best with violin music playing in the background. And one of the most delusional CEOs was the Hooters guy. He was talking about how he would be perfectly fine with his daughter working at Hooters. Then the manager where he was undercover was found to b…

I think you need to take what you see on reality TV with a grain of salt. That's the size of the moon.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#163

Post by eru »

newprint wrote: post #17
sharkweek wrote: post #4

I like to write short stories in my free time. One that I’ve been working on over the last year is one where the concept of “crowdfunded healthcare” evolves into a dystopian game show where people go on TV and share their sob story on why they need money. Then the viewers at home get to choose who gets the show’s prize money each season through a bracket style voting system that crowns a champion at the end. I had to…

I will be down-voted to hell, but I have worked in health insurance company. Large insurance companies have doctors and layers that basically sit down and make decisions about how much they will pay (if ever) for treatment. Your scenario has real life basis.

Isn't that how it has to work, if you want your insurance premiums to be finite?

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#164

Post by eru »

SequoiaHope wrote: post #52
sharkweek wrote: post #4

I like to write short stories in my free time. One that I’ve been working on over the last year is one where the concept of “crowdfunded healthcare” evolves into a dystopian game show where people go on TV and share their sob story on why they need money. Then the viewers at home get to choose who gets the show’s prize money each season through a bracket style voting system that crowns a champion at the end. I had to…

One thing I’ve been studying a lot on my free time is the deep history of the concept of socialism. Not a particular implementation but the idea that it would be a good idea for us to intentionally build a world where everyone has certain basic needs met by society at large. In particular there is a rich history of “libertarian socialism” which advocates for direct social support of one another without a state. Typic…

What you are describing is mostly independent of socialisms in the sense of 'who owns the means of production'.

A welfare state in an otherwise mostly capitalist society, like Scandinavia or Germany, has worked better in practice for these aims. Mostly because the pie is bigger than in the socialisms tried so far.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#165

Post by eru »

DFHippie wrote: post #161
akvadrako wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people's gripes about socialism are about central control. That's a vital part of the policies proposed by the left in the USA, especially the Green New Deal. And the worst aspect of Venezuela. "Libertarian socialism" is practically a form of anarchy and has nothing to do with the modern usage. If you want to make it acceptable and frictionless for people to voluntarily offer their services for free, I don't thi…

If someone can figure out how to fix the free rider problem without central control I think everyone would be happy. The problem with the libertarian solution -- purely voluntary charity -- are that a) it is proportional to sympathy rather than need, as many are observing above and b) it amounts to a tax on the generous and a self-reinforcing transfer of economic power and opportunity to the least pro-social members…

I don't see how using the state for welfare guarantees a better solution to (a)? It's just that in a democracy (a) goes by sympathy of the voters instead of sympathy of the rich.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#166

Post by DFHippie »

ekianjo wrote: post #155
A2017U1 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is the only major developed country that doesn't have universal healthcare and they are still deep "in the red".

At least the US is developing new drugs. About 99% of other countries produce none.

Citation?

Also, it's usual when comparing countries to restrict one's comparison to economic peers. If Lesotho or Vatican City aren't funding drug development, this doesn't say a lot about the relative merit of the U.S. system.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#167

Post by dmitriid »

conanbatt wrote: post #130
rosser wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How, exactly, has regulation driven the price of a drug we've had for decades up hundreds, even thousands, of percent, most of which increase happened after it was out of patent protection?

Who stops you from buying insulin outside the US and re-selling it in the domestic market?

conanbatt: you don't get clinical research from universal healthcare

HN: wrong, here's why

conanbatt: but medical tourism

HN: doesn't apply, here are reasons

conanbatt: the price goes up because of regulation

HN: wrong, here's why

conanbatt: what stops you fro buying in Canada

---

I haven't seen such blatant shifting of goalposts on HN in a while.

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#168

Post by dmitriid »

ekianjo wrote: post #155
A2017U1 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is the only major developed country that doesn't have universal healthcare and they are still deep "in the red".

At least the US is developing new drugs. About 99% of other countries produce none.

- 30% of drugs in the US are funded by taxpayer money [1]

- true, the US is producing about ~50% new drugs (sometimes more, sometimes less). Europe and Japan account for the most of the rest of the drugs [2]. The reason is simple: these are wealthy countries.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19264699

[2] http://www.hbmpartners.com/media/docs/industry-reports/Analy...

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#169

Post by [deleted] »

eru wrote: post #163
newprint wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will be down-voted to hell, but I have worked in health insurance company. Large insurance companies have doctors and layers that basically sit down and make decisions about how much they will pay (if ever) for treatment. Your scenario has real life basis.

Isn't that how it has to work, if you want your insurance premiums to be finite?

[deleted]

Re: GoFundMe CEO: ‘Gigantic Gaps’ in Health System Showing Up in Crowdfunding

#170

Post by linuxftw »

fatbird wrote: post #101
ekianjo wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On that note, I find it supremely fucked up that people have to turn to crowdfunding to get their unexpected healthcare costs covered by benevolent internet citizens. So who should pay for it? All taxpayers instead? All countries that have tried that are now in the red. The only good solution, I think, it to work to make healthcare a lot cheaper in the long run.

All the countries that have tried it are less in the red than the U.S. by any financial measure, and have longer life expectancies/lower infant mortality rates/better aggregate outcomes than the U.S., which is typically at the bottom of the scale for first world nations where medical outcomes are considered. And they spend less public dollars per capita than the U.S., which is an ironic twist. The pure, brute facts s…

If it's such an affordable and great idea, why don't CA & NY implement it independently of the rest of the states and let their residents utilize the system?

Why does it have to be an every-state solution?

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