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Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

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Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#211

Post by saagarjha »

CivBase wrote: post #169

I've never published an iOS app before. What exactly does a "developer certificate" do and why does it affect their ability to distribute internal apps in particular?

There are two certificates that are important here, with different requirements and capabilities. First, you have normal developer certificates, which you can use to submit apps to the App Store. On the other hand, you have enterprise certificates, which can be used to distribute apps outside of the App Store (and without Apple's review), and these are supposed to only be used for company use (such as internal beta testing or apps). Google and Facebook used their enterprise certificate to distribute an app to external users, most likely because the app would be rejected from the App Store, so Apple revoked their enterprise certificate.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#213

Post by Despegar »

zapzupnz wrote: post #167

Yeah, this is pretty clear cut. Apple has rule. Facebook and Google agree to rule. Facebook and Google violate rule. Apple enforces rule. This isn't some grey area where the details are difficult to ascertain. Everything is pretty clear; the enterprise app distribution service is most assuredly not for distributing apps that break the App Store rules to customers . This isn't difficult to understand, so I'm strugglin…

If you're Facebook or Google you're used to being able to dictate terms to others. But there's always a bigger fish and in this case it's Apple.

They're outraged because they have no recourse. What they usually do to users or partners, dictate take-it-or-leave-it terms, is being done to them. They can't even complain to antitrust regulators because Apple is only lord of its own kingdom (which doesn't have market dominance).

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#214

Post by blhack »

askafriend wrote: post #43

Let’s say you’re using a Google API like Maps, and you violate terms by snapshotting sections of their maps and storing them on your severs so you can serve static maps without making API calls. They’d shut down your API access immediately Google and Facebook both knew the terms. They both knew that the Enterprise Distribution Program was for internal use only. They still put ads out in the wild to recruit regular co…

Because lots of people still think that if you own a piece of hardware, you should be able to run whatever code you want on it.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#215

Post by saagarjha »

pbalau wrote: post #88
gorkish wrote: post #74

What I want to know is why these companies are using the same cert to sign apps with widely differing uses and security profiles. It seems to me that they should have a number of enterprise signing certs for each use case such as internal beta, external beta, internal utility, external utility, whatever. If the companies are signing all of their apps under the same cert then it's kind of on them for being stupid to s…

To my understanding, FB is using the enterprise cert to sign internal apps (which pointed me to my last replies on this thread) and another cert to sign things for general population. I think Google does the same.

Yes; internal apps are signed with an enterprise certificate and App Store apps use a standard developer certificate.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#216

Post by johnsea »

zapzupnz wrote: post #132
johnsea wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple should not have the right to enforce those conditions to begin with. Same as they should not be allowed to kick out apps from their whole platform on a whim. Inacceptable. Such a company should not be allowed to do business in EU. Much worse than what happened with Microsoft in the 90ties.

Why should they not have the right to enforce the terms of their own service ? They own it, the operate it. It's theirs to do with as they wish. Your comment might make sense of Apple were some sort of government entity, but it isn't; it was completely Facebook and Google's decision to abide by Apple's terms and conditions, something that will have been pored over by legal team upon legal team. This is not something…

> Why should they not have the right to enforce the terms of their own service? They own it, the operate it. It's theirs to do with as they wish.

Because they became too big. It's the right of e.g. the EU to allow them to operate. Or better said, the law could be changed to disallow operation if certainy conditions are not met. Apple then has the choice to either adapt or leave the EU market.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#218

Post by mjw1007 »

zapzupnz wrote: post #132
johnsea wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple should not have the right to enforce those conditions to begin with. Same as they should not be allowed to kick out apps from their whole platform on a whim. Inacceptable. Such a company should not be allowed to do business in EU. Much worse than what happened with Microsoft in the 90ties.

Why should they not have the right to enforce the terms of their own service ? They own it, the operate it. It's theirs to do with as they wish. Your comment might make sense of Apple were some sort of government entity, but it isn't; it was completely Facebook and Google's decision to abide by Apple's terms and conditions, something that will have been pored over by legal team upon legal team. This is not something…

The difference is that Apple are controlling what software individuals can run on their own phones that they paid good money for.

The problem isn't that Apple are allowed to throw Google out of the enterprise program; the problem is that Apple users aren't allowed to install Google's apps without Apple's permission.

It's fair enough to say that Google can't complain because they knew the terms of the enterprise agreement. But I'm not sure it's fair to say that Apple phone purchasers are clearly told when they buy a phone that Apple can disable their employer's internal apps.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#219

Post by MBCook »

kodablah wrote: post #133
zapzupnz wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Android has 85% of the worldwide smartphone market I think a mistake to make here is thinking that Apple gives a toss.

In fact, one could reasonably say Apple actively tries not to obtain too large of a market percentage to avoid laws affecting monopolies.

You think so? I think they don’t chase market share, but not to avoid anti-trust issues.

Re: Apple blocks Google from running its internal iOS apps

#220

Post by saagarjha »

gorkish wrote: post #74

What I want to know is why these companies are using the same cert to sign apps with widely differing uses and security profiles. It seems to me that they should have a number of enterprise signing certs for each use case such as internal beta, external beta, internal utility, external utility, whatever. If the companies are signing all of their apps under the same cert then it's kind of on them for being stupid to s…

> It seems to me that they should have a number of enterprise signing certs for each use case such as internal beta, external beta, internal utility, external utility, whatever.

Apple does not normally give these out (and why would they?)

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