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Apple's Mistake

paulgraham.com

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Re: Apple's Mistake

#201

Post by [deleted] »

wvenable wrote: post #51
credo wrote: post #27

I agree with the primary point that Apple is making a mistake in not treating developers well. However, I think that the essay misses a couple of points. 1. The essay rejects the notion of an "intermediary" or a "software publisher". However, it fails to appreciate the fact Apple has opened up the mobile app market to developers and eliminated far worse intermediaries (the walled gardens of carriers). This is a huge…

1. Carriers never had walled gardens around smartphones. Apple didn't invent smartphones, they've been around for years before the iPhone was released. In fact, the carrier (AT&T) has more control than they do on blackberries or WinMo phones. 2. I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. The review process exists so developers are already doing their best to not be rejected and Apple is rejecting anything badly-bug…

[deleted]

Re: Apple's Mistake

#202

Post by ivankirigin »

Luyt wrote: post #182
pg wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bought it as a computer. It's my new, separate machine for using the Internet, as described here: http://www.paulgraham.com/distraction.html

The moment Apple decides to make a model with a non-glaring screen, I'll buy one too.

I've seen people use "privacy screens" on latops make them matte

Re: Apple's Mistake

#203

Post by [deleted] »

akamaka wrote: post #187
joecode wrote: post #126

Talk about it. I just got a rejection today for a major bugfix on my last update. The only change in the update is to use utf-8 encoding---one tiny change on one line of code. After 2 weeks, they tell me they can't approve the update because I'm using undocumented APIs in a couple places. Sure, OK, looks like I was using some methods that went from deprecated to undocumented... but that's exactly what's in the store…

I think it's worth pointing out that even Apple's own developers don't get the luxury of being able to push out bug fixes whenever they want. Point releases of the iPhone OS are often months apart, so good testing is not optional for them.

[deleted]

Re: Apple's Mistake

#204

Post by forensic »

cpr wrote: post #158

I think a lot of the problem stems from the fact that Jobs hates third party apps (because he can't control them), and he always has, and always will. He just realizes he can't build a successful product, long-term, without them. But his main internal smart software guys know better, and build a great software ecosystem. Thus Apple is now projecting a seriously schizoid personality.

But see this is the dynamic between the user and the developer. This kind of tension is necessary to the process.

When developers can make whatever they feel like making, we get linux.

When Steve Jobs is there to lobby for the customer, to lobby for beauty and ease of use and a focus on the details and thorough documentation, then we get OS X and the other "It Just Works" features that Apple is becoming known for.

Customers want a Steve Jobs parental figure to stand there beating back the hordes of opportunistic Bonzi Buddy coders trying to make a quick million. That's why people pay premiums for Apple products.

Love it or hate it, the philosophy behind the App Store is a large part of Apple's growing success. The philosophy is that the user will pay more and in return the developer has to jump through some hoops and get his app approved.

Having said that, obviously the approval process needs to be adjusted. It sounds relatively trivial, in fact, for Apple to implement a procedure that would allow minor bug fixes while still putting apps through an approval process.

It would be great if customers could trust developers, but the truth is they can't. This has been proven over and over again. For every hacker that is dedicated to making something people need, there are ten willing to code exploitative Facebook apps and spambots and spyware and toolbars and programs that run in the background and phone home constantly so they can sell user data.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#205

Post by nearestneighbor »

joecode wrote: post #126

Talk about it. I just got a rejection today for a major bugfix on my last update. The only change in the update is to use utf-8 encoding---one tiny change on one line of code. After 2 weeks, they tell me they can't approve the update because I'm using undocumented APIs in a couple places. Sure, OK, looks like I was using some methods that went from deprecated to undocumented... but that's exactly what's in the store…

Does Apple examine your source code?! I thought iPhone devs kept the source to themselves.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#206

Post by forensic »

nickpp wrote: post #80

That mobile platform has already arrived. It's called Windows Mobile. I was surprised too: my wife has a 3GS and I was planning to get one for myself too. Instead I got a HTC Diamond2 which I plan to upgrade to a HTC HD2. I'm a developer, not a essay-writing millionaire. I like platforms that are Powerful, flexible and CUSTOMIZABLE to my taste. I like pretty too, but form has to follow function, not the other way aro…

But does your wife want a hackable phone? Does she really care?

Does she want to have to deal with it when she downloads an app that sounds cool and it ends up installing spyware on her machine and drains her battery and drops her phonecalls?

Or would she maybe rather give up some hackable freedom for ease-of-use and a promise of a protected experience?

Re: Apple's Mistake

#207

Post by forensic »

gcheong wrote: post #156
allenp wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep seeing this notion of opening the platform brought up here. I'm having a hard time visualizing how this works out. Does Apple continue the overhead/cost of the app store? Do they have a giant disclaimer that they do not support or condone the applications, take no responsibility for any damages, etc? Do they still act as the payment gateway? How does this impact Apple's brand and the consumer trust of the prod…

"Do they have a giant disclaimer that they do not support or condone the applications, take no responsibility for any damages, etc?" Read your iTunes agreement. I think you will find that they already have this.

There's a big difference between a legal disclaimer that no one reads and a marketing disclaimer.

Apple unofficially accepts responsibility for the AppStore apps. They don't vouch for their quality per se, but they do vouch for the fact that they won't wreck your phone.

The same can't be said for apps on an open platform.

Hackers love open platforms but users flee them because the experience is painful.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#208

Post by forensic »

cma wrote: post #197
jcl wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, then Apple couldn't screen for the things that they care about but that users won't report. For example, applications that use Apple/iPhone imagery wouldn't get reported because users don't care about the dilution of Apple's brand. Likewise, applications that encourage the user to do things that might damage the device (swinging, throwing, or dropping) wouldn't be reported because the device is broken -- a…

If I create a website that tells you that you should play the (already existant) Super Monkey Ball app by wildly swinging it around like a monkey, should Apple blacklist my site from all iphone users? (Bonus points: if not, why, and how is it different from your example?)

Apple is a private company, not a government.

The question you should ask is do Apple customers want Apple to protect them from those sites?

I work with non-hacker computer users all day long and the answer is emphatically that they do want Apple to hold their hand and protect them so they can get their work done without having to fight with their machine. They want a padded room where they don't have to constantly worry about bandaging themselves up from being accidentally impaled on some spike around the corner.

Users definitely want a controlled ecosystem that is somewhat sanitized and they are willing to take it at the expense of having the latest greatest features, and also at the expense of paying more.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#209

Post by forensic »

serhei wrote: post #164

Paul Graham criticizes the App Store, which is significant because it's a rare instance of a person with such major hacker street cred and no vested interest in the platform putting in their two cents... ... then he gives a really insane Request for Startups: http://ycombinator.com/rfs5.html . I think the current upper limit for input bandwidth on a 4-inch or so screen means that you would really have to invent somet…

You can already run emacs on the iPhone. The issue is just that the keyboard sucks. But right now I can do all my regular dev tasks on the iPhone by SSHing in my webserver.

It's just kind of pointless because you get 50X the productivity by bringing your laptop with you. My 13" MacBook doesn't exactly weigh me down.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#210

Post by rbarooah »

I found it an interesting read. I especially liked the sentiment, "An organization that wins by exercising power starts to lose the ability to win by doing better work.", which I firmly believe.

However I don't see how PG shows that Apple is somehow winning by exercising power. Can someone clarify this? PG even? I don't hear any explanation of how their exercise of power is helping them win.

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