Live data from Hacker News

The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

rollingstone.com

201–210 of 223 posts

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#201
post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> biden imported millions of third worlders with no vetting through a combination of lack of border enforcement and wide ranging refugee and amnesty efforts. Everyone who told you those mistruths was lying to you hoping against you’d vote against your interests. Biden not only enforced immigration laws, he was doing so at a higher rate. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/trump-dep...

Only in 2023-2024. Overall, Biden's tenure saw the largest immigration inflow in US history, and about 2/3 of it was illegal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/11/briefing/us-immigration-s...

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bet you they subcontract them as slave labour to make a quick buck.

No doubt about it. Even in the U.S. we have a serious slavery problem. If you are incarcerated you do not have the same rights and most certainly can and will be made to labor if you want any hope of getting out. "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction…

if that is a serious slavery problem , what is it thats libya having?

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

"Neri Alvarado Borges was told by ICE officers that he was arrested in February for his tattoos — one of which is a rainbow-colored autism awareness ribbon with the name of his brother, who is autistic." "The Trump administration admitted in court documents that 'many' of those sent to El Salvador did not have criminal records. As more information about those deported was unearthed, it became clear that some of the '…

[flagged]

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah anyone criticizing the mass incarceration in El Salvador as unjust should really familiarize themselves with the crimes of the gangs down there. The obliteration of a social scourge in a single presidency was nothing short of miraculous. That's why Bukele was re-elected at the highest levels in history - his people genuinely love him for it. The right to a fair trial is great in places that have law and order, b…

> you won't miss that right at all. Until the day the goons break down your door and drag you away. Then you'll wish you had a fair trial. "It'll never happen to me if I keep may head down" will ensure no one will feel safe about publicly opposing the president on any issue. Your dictator is not special, most of them concentrate their power by claiming to address an issue that's legitimately concerns a lot of citizen…

That fails to understand how power in exceptional situations persists: namely that it still must be supported by key stakeholders.

If a leader were to summarily arrest large numbers of random citizens, suddenly they'd lose the support of citizens, one of the key pillars keeping them in power.

Which is why you see empowered and pervasive secret police institutions in societies like this -- you require a credible and effective alternative to popular support.

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Neri Alvarado Borges was told by ICE officers that he was arrested in February for his tattoos — one of which is a rainbow-colored autism awareness ribbon with the name of his brother, who is autistic." "The Trump administration admitted in court documents that 'many' of those sent to El Salvador did not have criminal records. As more information about those deported was unearthed, it became clear that some of the '…

[flagged]

Those quotes are from three different sources. Which of those would you consider “bullshit” and why?

If the Tesla vandals deserve to be in a lunatic asylum or charged with hate speech, fine. Go through the legal process to prove it in court. But to suggest that they deserve to be sent to a foreign black site for a lifetime of torture is simply unhuman.

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#206
post #34

It's like the UK Rwandan exile program, but somehow worse.

Far... far... worse. The Rwanda exile program at least had some concept of due process in both the UK and Rwanda. The Rwanada exile program was at least stopped when the courts told it to instead of trying to remain secret long enough to avoid the courts having a chance to forbid it, and then outright ignoring the court orders forbidding it when that failed. Here the program is "ICE picks you up off the street, witho…

> the US has no authority to bring you back.

They're paying to keep you there, but """can't""" bring you back.

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Who would stop that abduction from happening with force? What if the men doing that are police officers? What if they go after your family the day after? Now you understand why the Black Panthers arose: the black community realized that it needed to arm itself to protect against the oppressive power of the state. It could be argued that modern infringements on the Second Amendment are largely a reaction of the gove…

Have you used your gun to overthrow the state? Why not?

I derive substantial portions of my wealth-building from the military-industrial complex, while living outside of the US insulates me, and my children, from the worst of both America's fractured society AND from the authoritarian overreach that typically disproportionately affects minorities such as myself.

For my family unit, the path through all this chaos of imperial decline involves building up sustainable property ownership and revenue streams in Asia and Africa while winding down our US footprint to a minimum (real estate, social security/military pension/VA benefits).

For me to engage in an insurgency, the government would need to seize our US home, and/or cancel our benefits. Even then I'd need to work out some cost-benefit analysis to determine whether I could maximize my children's wealth by either a) continuing to build wealth outside the US or b) fighting to gain restitution via the new revolutionary government.

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#208
post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> biden imported millions of third worlders with no vetting through a combination of lack of border enforcement and wide ranging refugee and amnesty efforts. Everyone who told you those mistruths was lying to you hoping against you’d vote against your interests. Biden not only enforced immigration laws, he was doing so at a higher rate. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/trump-dep...

Only in 2023-2024. Overall, Biden's tenure saw the largest immigration inflow in US history, and about 2/3 of it was illegal. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/11/briefing/us-immigration-s...

Immigrants don't worry me, fascists do. I don't stay up at night worried an immigrant might deport me or send me to a prison to be raped

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Who would stop that abduction from happening with force? What if the men doing that are police officers? What if they go after your family the day after? Now you understand why the Black Panthers arose: the black community realized that it needed to arm itself to protect against the oppressive power of the state. It could be argued that modern infringements on the Second Amendment are largely a reaction of the gove…

The only thing I see is that having guns everywhere around does nothing to actually stop a country from descending into fascism. Thanks, I'll stay in my region, at least we have no school shootings or violent crime.

>The only thing I see is that having guns everywhere around does nothing to actually stop a country from descending into fascism.

The US is charting new ground here. Almost every other massively-oppressive state apparatus has prioritized restricting private firearms ownership early in their decent into tyranny for a reason.

> Thanks, I'll stay in my region, at least we have no school shootings or violent crime.

The rate of firearms ownership in the US has been on a slow decline for the past 40-50 years (not sure how accurate data is before 1970 or 1980), from roughly 45% to 30%. School shootings have skyrocketed in the past ~30 years, and were pretty rare before Columbine. The two don't appear to be correlated. How do you reconcile this? I suspect that other societal factors are more salient causes.....perhaps the explosion in single-mother parenthood (something like 40% of all families now), combined with the known impacts on poor juvenile behavior in young boys and the explosion in "attention culture" courtesy of social media are the major factors in emotionally unstable teens gunning down their peers?

That said....I live in a country with almost no firearms and also have the peace of mind that nobody is gonna shoot my children. But I'm also in a homogeneous society that has almost no concern or risk level for their government turning tyrannical.

Re: The 'Judicial Black Hole' of El Salvador's Prisons Is a Warning for Americans

#210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans, not content with learning from others' mistakes, will now be learning them first hand. The horrors are just beginning.

Historians, particularly ones who study fascism and Russia/Eastern Europe are already fleeing the country. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/story/the-fascism-expert-at-...

I would leave too, but I'd have to abandon a couple loved ones
Post reply on HN