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Orbit by Mozilla

orbitbymozilla.com

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Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#201

Post by politelemon »

mentalgear wrote: post #181

I'm reading a lot of criticism here, some I understand, but honestly, this sounds pretty good for a free LLM service: "Orbit doesn't require account creation or save your session data." Maybe we shouldn't be too critical of Mozilla for providing a privacy-first LLM service - for free. The other big privacy-first LLM provider is Apple, which requires users to have their devices/subscriptions to use, and definitely use…

> The other big privacy-first LLM provider is Apple, which requires users to have their devices/subscriptions to use, and definitely uses advanced telemetry by default.

By definition then, Apple's is most certainly not privacy first by any stretch of mental gymnastics.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#202

Post by mattvr »

mentalgear wrote: post #194
mattvr wrote: post #175

If you're interested in this, you might like https://nuggetize.com/ which works without installing anything and with any browser.

It looks like a nice marketing product, but nowhere it acknowledges how bad LLMs are in general for summarization, or what techniques, if any, the devs use to counteract this. (also, their dev page https://orgsoft.org/ claim "NO BS", but again does not provide details, proof, not even an about page or a business address which is a red flag.

Hey, thanks for the critique (this is my product)! Yeah, LLM summarization definitely has its challenges. We've actually spent months optimizing for this:

1. Using latest models (gpt-4o & claude-3.5) which show major improvements in quality

2. Extensive prompt engineering focused on distilling surprising insights vs. pure summarization

3. Structured output format that's easier to parse

Re: transparency - you're right, we need to add more details. I'm new to this and still learning how to communicate this.

Btw, it's free to use 1x/day, and here's an example: https://nuggetize.com/n/claude-shannon-wikipedia-47ca5e5b

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#203

Post by mentalgear »

kome wrote: post #192
mentalgear wrote: post #181

I'm reading a lot of criticism here, some I understand, but honestly, this sounds pretty good for a free LLM service: "Orbit doesn't require account creation or save your session data." Maybe we shouldn't be too critical of Mozilla for providing a privacy-first LLM service - for free. The other big privacy-first LLM provider is Apple, which requires users to have their devices/subscriptions to use, and definitely use…

[flagged]

Agreed, I also often get that feeling of a double standard.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#204

Post by hulitu »

ripped_britches wrote: post #165
sitkack wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you aren't running an encrypted disk on any cloud provider you should absolutely fundamentally understand that your data has been scanned and that your VM data is "business data" so a copy gets sent to whomever wants it, in bulk.

Maybe if you are like a high profile target of a state actor, but otherwise this is a paranoid take

Taking into accout that, the first thing Firefox does, is connect to a Google server (e100.net) , i would say it is a good founded concern.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#205

Post by IshKebab »

silisili wrote: post #168

Mozilla will spend any amount it takes to do anything but build a better browser.

Their browser is fine. But so is Chrome, and Chrome wins by default because it's installed by default on Android and Android really pushes you to it. Once you're using Chrome on Android and have all your passwords saved there, Firefox is a difficult sell.

I can't think of a single Firefox feature that's better than "I don't have to faff around with passwords". Maybe if they allowed adblock on mobile, but last I checked they were fannying around requiring nightly builds and whitelisting extensions...

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#206

Post by Too »

ericra wrote: post #12

Info from the FAQ: - Currently using Mistral 7B, but ability (by Mozilla) to swap the model used to another open source at any point. - Hosted "by Mozilla" on their GCP instance. - No obvious info about what it will cost them to run this since it is free to use. - No training on user data. Like others here, I'm very curious about the cost for Mozilla to run this service. It may be less than it initially appears given…

If you scroll to the bottom of the page it appears like this is made by Fakespot, https://www.fakespot.com/our-mission. They explain that they make money through ads, for their other similar product, wouldn't be far to guess that's the future strategy here as well.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#207

Post by vasco »

kome wrote: post #192
mentalgear wrote: post #181

I'm reading a lot of criticism here, some I understand, but honestly, this sounds pretty good for a free LLM service: "Orbit doesn't require account creation or save your session data." Maybe we shouldn't be too critical of Mozilla for providing a privacy-first LLM service - for free. The other big privacy-first LLM provider is Apple, which requires users to have their devices/subscriptions to use, and definitely use…

[flagged]

Mozilla's problem for me is they wasted their market dominance by hiring grifters as their leaders and allowed bad actors to come in.

I have nothing to base it off other than the results, but someone with a tinfoil hat would wonder if Google chose or influenced the choice of Mozillas leadership to allow Chrome to grow by destroying it from the inside. They were already basically bankrolling the whole company so it's not a big stretch.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#208

Post by bowsamic »

bayindirh wrote: post #180
silisili wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me 12 times or so shame on me. /s, kinda. The OP claimed it got better in 2017, and it didn't meet my standards. But I'm honest that I haven't tried it in 2 years. If some news or person came out to suggest something big changed and I should try it again, I will. Otherwise I'm just wasting time for no reason.

As a person who never used Chrome in a capacity to replace Firefox (I just refused to give up), I'll just share this [0]. As I understand, no amount of words can convince you because I neither know what your standards are, nor I have the right words to convince you to try Firefox again. So, you have to give it a try and see it for yourself. As a matter of principle, I'd never use a browser which is funded by an adver…

> As a matter of principle, I'd never use a browser which is funded by an advertisement company which lives off my data to show me ads and rob me of my privacy and cognitive capacity.

You can’t use Firefox either then

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#209

Post by bayindirh »

bowsamic wrote: post #208
bayindirh wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a person who never used Chrome in a capacity to replace Firefox (I just refused to give up), I'll just share this [0]. As I understand, no amount of words can convince you because I neither know what your standards are, nor I have the right words to convince you to try Firefox again. So, you have to give it a try and see it for yourself. As a matter of principle, I'd never use a browser which is funded by an adver…

> As a matter of principle, I'd never use a browser which is funded by an advertisement company which lives off my data to show me ads and rob me of my privacy and cognitive capacity. You can’t use Firefox either then

I can disable all its telemetry, and change my search engine. It becomes a box which receives but never emits.

Plus, I don't use its Mozilla build, but its Debian build.

Re: Orbit by Mozilla

#210

Post by hu3 »

a57721 wrote: post #174
hu3 wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice! Thank you! I just wonder if browsers will limit the amount of characters in URLs. If memory serves me, there was a limit. But it might be high enough to work fro most pages.

Modern browsers are not an issue here, e.g. chromium allows 2MB; the issue is with web server's limits.

Indeed, I'm getting Cloudflare error "414 Request-URI Too Large" for this HN post which isn't large.

But the URL bar was not the problem.

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