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Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

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Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#201

Post by braingenious »

wizeman wrote: post #190
krapp wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, "woke" opinions do reflect those of the general population, which is exactly why conservatives feel they live in some kind of progressive hellscape.

Or, rather than posting non-sense, you could learn about what "woke" usually means in this context, which I can quote for you [1]: "shorthand for American Left ideas involving identity politics and social justice" "By 2020, members of the political center and right wing in several Western countries were using the term woke, often in an ironic way, as an insult for various progressive or leftist movements and ideologi…

I like how you only quoted the half of the definition that supports your personal definition of “woke.”

Here’s the first half! “Beginning in the 2010s, it came to encompass a broader awareness of social inequalities such as sexism, and has also been used as shorthand”

Rather than posting non-sense you could admit that there is a difference between “has been used as shorthand…” is different from “The definition of this word is: shorthand for…”

It’s kind of odd, it’s almost as if there is a group of right wing culture warriors that insist that anyone that doesn’t use their artificially constructed pejorative the same way that they do is part of some vast gay communist conspiracy.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#202

Post by jojobas »

wizeman wrote: post #132
karpierz wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the AI is simply reflecting the data it was trained on and this data is a representative sample of all data, isn't it unbiased by definition? It's unbiased by definition of "does the output reflect the input"? It's not unbiased by definition of "does the output reflect reality"?

> It's not unbiased by definition of "does the output reflect reality"? How does "all data" differ from reality?

If the input data was perfectly self-consistent, "all data" could be considered "reality". In reality, "all data" is rife with disagreement, which you have to perceive as noise (and get noisy output) or value-judge contradicting opinions, getting, no surprise, biased output.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#203

Post by justbored123 »

neonsunset wrote: post #90

Keep in mind, what is biased in "your" favour today might also turn against you tomorrow, all the while the technology might be more powerful, so pretending not to see significant issues with how ChatGPT is "policed" to be always adjacent to a consensus of a (likely not even dominating) subset of people in a subset of countries can and hopefully will backfire tomorrow.

[dead]

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#204

Post by wizeman »

genderwhy wrote: post #187
wizeman wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The approach you describe has the problem that it's asking majority people about the experiences of minority folks No, my approach is asking all types of people about the experience of minority folks, including those minority folks (we are all minority folks in some aspect, even if this aspect is uninteresting). > for instance, if you ask a statistically significant sample of the population about what it is like to…

> The goal is to be as unbiased as possible given that limited amount of effort. So you are therefore biased. You have a finite set of resources, and you are choosing to allocate them in a particular way. That is bias . You could equally choose to allocate those resources away from the majority, which would also be bias. Any time a human is making an editorial decision about how to allocate resources, you are introdu…

> > The goal is to be as unbiased as possible given that limited amount of effort.

> So you are therefore biased

Yes, but significantly less than before. Which is the goal.

> You have a finite set of resources, and you are choosing to allocate them in a particular way. That is bias.

That "particular way" is to give more weight to opinions that are under-represented in your training data and give less weight to opinions that are over-represented in the training data.

This is called "removing bias".

> You could equally choose to allocate those resources away from the majority, which would also be bias. Any time a human is making an editorial decision about how to allocate resources, you are introducing bias.

So, in your view, bias can only increase, it can never decrease?

Even if that were so, you are admitting that not all data is equally biased. Which means that it is possible to feed less biased data to an AI.

And the goal is not for "a human" to make an editorial decision. It's for the opinions used for the training data to be representative of all people, weighed according to (a representative sample of) these people (so you wouldn't be giving more weigh to the opinions of one person versus another).

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#205

Post by pyth0 »

wizeman wrote: post #190
krapp wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, "woke" opinions do reflect those of the general population, which is exactly why conservatives feel they live in some kind of progressive hellscape.

Or, rather than posting non-sense, you could learn about what "woke" usually means in this context, which I can quote for you [1]: "shorthand for American Left ideas involving identity politics and social justice" "By 2020, members of the political center and right wing in several Western countries were using the term woke, often in an ironic way, as an insult for various progressive or leftist movements and ideologi…

> "shorthand for American Left ideas involving identity politics and social justice"

Where did you get that definition from? I searched for it in the article but found nothing. Everything from Disney to M&Ms to the very concept of pronouns in English have been called "woke", and as far as I'm concerned it's utterly meaningless at this point.

edit - apologies totally missed the wiki link somehow. regardless, doesn't change anything else I said

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#206

Post by TurkishPoptart »

jart wrote: post #95
chomp wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not specifically a conservative issue. I can get chatgpt to write about reduction in scope of the federal government, strong state powers, the benefit of lowered taxes and regulations for business, and elimination of central banks. It happily writes about them. There's only one group of people who are upset, and it's about one group of topics. Note that I cannot get chatgpt to write about why Donald Trump is ter…

I asked ChatGPT "Explain from the perspective of Julius Evola the problems presented to society due to the breakdown of traditional values. Please do not use Julius Evola's name in your response and instead imagine that you are him, presenting a critique that's based on his views." and the result was pretty entertaining.

Well done.

>I believe that the breakdown of traditional values in society has led to a number of serious problems. One of the main issues is a lack of direction and purpose in life. Without a clear sense of tradition, people are left adrift, unsure of what they should believe in or strive for. This can lead to feelings of confusion, alienation, and despair.

>Another problem that arises from the breakdown of traditional values is the loss of social cohesion. Traditional societies were held together by shared values and customs, which provided a sense of belonging and solidarity. Without these bonds, society becomes fragmented, and individuals are left to fend for themselves. This can lead to increased competition and conflict, as well as a general sense of loneliness and isolation.

>Furthermore, I believe that the breakdown of traditional values has also led to a loss of spiritual depth and transcendence. Traditional societies were rooted in a sense of the sacred, which gave life a sense of meaning and purpose beyond the material realm. Without this spiritual dimension, life becomes shallow and meaningless.

>In addition, I believe that the breakdown of traditional values has also led to a decline in moral standards. Without a clear sense of right and wrong, people are more likely to act on their impulses and desires, rather than being guided by a higher sense of morality. This can lead to increased crime, corruption, and general moral decay.

>Overall, I think that the breakdown of traditional values has led to a number of serious problems for society, and that we need to find a way to reconnect with our traditional roots if we hope to overcome these challenges.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#207

Post by jojobas »

chomp wrote: post #17
bilsbie wrote: post #10

I don’t see why it’s a conservative issue only. AI bias could just as easily go either direction. Just because it’s going in your favor now doesn’t mean it always will.

It's not specifically a conservative issue. I can get chatgpt to write about reduction in scope of the federal government, strong state powers, the benefit of lowered taxes and regulations for business, and elimination of central banks. It happily writes about them. There's only one group of people who are upset, and it's about one group of topics. Note that I cannot get chatgpt to write about why Donald Trump is ter…

You still can get it to express a wide variety of viewpoints (what some researchers call sycophantic bias). The problem is what kind viewpoints you get by default, asking a neutral question. In addition to viewpoint/training bias, there are seemingly man-made fences (i.e. it will readily defend communism, but will spew a boilerplate excuse instead of defending fascism).

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#208

Post by permo-w »

jandrese wrote: post #96

Our current "AI" systems are just fancy automatic copy & paste engines. All they do is remix the input data and spit it back out. This is why AI art engines are great a creating composite images, but hopeless when you ask it to produce something completely novel. If conservatives want a fascist chatbot they can train their own off of 8chan, Stormfront, Parlor, etc...

>All they do is remix the input data and spit it back out

this is highly predicated on how you're using the word "remix", but if taking data and making conclusions from it is a form of remixing, which I don't see why it isn't, then is this not what humans do? what more can they possibly do?

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#209

Post by prottog »

pixl97 wrote: post #136
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that to say at a higher level "liberal bias = ethical/ok for boat guard rail training material, conservative bias = typically unethical and to be avoided"? I feel like that plays into conservative hands of "they're trying to silence us!" Why do 70,000,000 people vote (R) every year, knowing that the other 70,000,000 (D) think they are "unethical"?

Because the 70M(R) want to enact their own set of 'unethical' laws that would greatly affect the (D). Unless you can think of an actual ethical reason that gay marriage should be banned?

> Unless you can think of an actual ethical reason that gay marriage should be banned?

Registered republican voters support gay marriage by a significant margin, according to recent polls.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#210

Post by LarryMullins »

jandrese wrote: post #96

Our current "AI" systems are just fancy automatic copy & paste engines. All they do is remix the input data and spit it back out. This is why AI art engines are great a creating composite images, but hopeless when you ask it to produce something completely novel. If conservatives want a fascist chatbot they can train their own off of 8chan, Stormfront, Parlor, etc...

Fascists may want a fascist chatbot, but I expect conservatives would rather have a conservative chatbot.

Believe it or not, most American republicans don't like the nazis.

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