Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Gen Z does not dream of labor

vox.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

201–210 of 510 posts

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#201

Post by noasaservice »

bombcar wrote: post #181
zdragnar wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Growing, but still rural city in the Midwest I visited a few weeks back has decent homes for sale in the 50-80k range. This is not an outlier. Roughly 2/3 of Americans own homes. If you live in an area where homes are priced like luxury investments, then yes, you'll have a hard time buying when you also cannot afford other luxuries. If you live in an area where they are not, it isn't unattainable at all, especially i…

Many people would consider a suggestion to live in the Midwest as about the same as a suggestion that they spend the rest of their life living in a decrepit sewer system.

And you'll get the politics and the religosity of the bible belt to boot.

There's a few islands of sanity here in the midwest, primarily around college towns. But... prices have doubled since 2016, at least in my area.

We're closing on a house. $375k. I'm one of the lucky ones. Like, super lucky. But it sold back in 2016 for $170k.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#202

Post by dghughes »

nineplay wrote: post #65
burlesona wrote: post #14

> “My dad got a job straight out of high school, saved up, and bought a house in his 20s,” said Anne Dakota, a 21-year-old receptionist from Asheville, North Carolina, who earns minimum wage. “I don’t even think that’s possible for me, at least with the current money I make.” I think this is pretty much the whole story. It’s very hard to be motivated to work when you could save your entire adult life and still strugg…

Gen Z's parents are my age or younger and IME there were few people who graduated with a high school diploma and bought a house. I bought my first house at 39 though obviously the housing bubble had a lot to do with that. I never felt particularly worried about my lack of home ownership. Pre-kids it allows for a lot of flexibility, one can easily move around as desires and job opportunities change. I'm not sure why a…

>It seems like younger generations view of their parents times are getting rosier and rosier.

I think so. Next will be Gen Alpha (apparently) who will complain about how easy Gen Z had it or maybe they'll blame Millenials.

I'm Gen X and in a small town I was never able to afford a home. And now rent is nuts people are being kicked out for "reno-victions". My parents born in '43 and '44 managed to buy a house but with help a program similar to Habitat for Humanity only a local organization. And then the early 80s inflation hit but they had a locked in mortgage but many people lost their homes.

It's always the same thing history repeats. But now people have so much more opportunities with the Internet they can choose almost any job. Even for me working from home was futuristic fantasy if it was even that. I think the trend to dehumanize and blame previous generations for the current generations' problems is a dangerous trend.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#203

Post by closeparen »

azinman2 wrote: post #159
spaniard89277 wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COL and everything, 135K is like the 1% in Spain. On topic: I have the same feeling. I'm trying to get a dev job, that would be a huge jump of income for me. But I'm 34, how much should I grind just to get "entry-level" stuff? I was pretty unmativated in my job, just coasting by and pretty much doing the bare minimum that allowed me to be in peace with myself. Remote work increased my productivity and my hapiness ove…

135k is closer to 1% in the US than you’d think.

In any given city the number of homes for sale is a small percentage of the population, and even then most of those homes will trade between incumbent owners. Prospective first time buyers are competing over the number of new housing units & units freed by out-migration, downsizing, and death. People are living longer. Boomers are aging in place. It’s pretty ordinary that would-be buyers outnumber these units more than 99:1. So merely being in the top 1% of prospective buyers is necessary, not sufficient. And since prices have gone up recently, prospective buyers are higher income than the city as a whole.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#204

Post by garciasn »

skulk wrote: post #184
midislack wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you joking? In this example rent is only a small fraction of income.

As another commenter pointed out, a 3.5% down FHA loan would make it feasible to buy a house with those numbers. But in any case, $80k is up there in terms of typical trades salaries, at least if cursory Googling can be trusted. Your median tradesman makes far less.

Where I live (Mpls), tradespeople make six figure salaries and are well above the median HHI for the area.

I lead a team that includes Zoomers and they are making six-figure salaries and are way ahead of where I was (accounting for inflation) when I was at their age.

This is more generational comparison garbage like the claims that Millennials were the downfall of our civilization. Just ignore it and move on.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#205

Post by rtlfe »

woojoo666 wrote: post #188
wonnage wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, if you save every cent and commit to being single without children for 8 years. But if you go to the dentist, drop your phone on accident, find an S/O, go to the gym, eat out every once in a while, buy some new clothes, pay off student loans, ... It's just very silly to find a website, grab a number, and then conclude that saving 200k in 8 years is realistic

I think the living expenses include health expenses, but other expenses like phones and travel probably not

I doubt this hypothetical person making $80k has a Cadillac health plan. They could definitely be looking at costs like $1500 for a dental crown and $1000 for an MRI before they hit their deductible.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#206

Post by syshum »

Mezzie wrote: post #115
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #25

> “I don’t have goals. I don’t have ambition. I only want to be attractive.” This apathetic declaration is the start of a TikTok rant that went viral for its blatant message: to reject hard work and indulge in leisure. It’s weird to see these opinions presented as a new phenomenon. Wanting to avoid work and indulge in leisure is a tale as old as time. It’s even a common theme among characters in ancient writings. Wha…

I think you're on to something, but there is one thing that I question: > As far as I can tell, the difference was that by the time they reached mid 20s they were quickly running out of peers who would tell them it was a good idea to embrace such a lifestyle forever. The real world catches up and you notice that your real-world friends who work normal jobs and “settle down” are actually having a good time (on average…

>>re buried under student loans, and can't save enough for retirement.

we have almost 3 years of deferment now for student loan debt, if they have not been able to improve their situations in that time this speaks more to financial ignorance than it does not being able to afford things.

I wonder how many of your friends know what a 50/30/20 budget is? Do they actually track all of their expenses properly, etc.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#207

Post by [deleted] »

azinman2 wrote: post #159
spaniard89277 wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COL and everything, 135K is like the 1% in Spain. On topic: I have the same feeling. I'm trying to get a dev job, that would be a huge jump of income for me. But I'm 34, how much should I grind just to get "entry-level" stuff? I was pretty unmativated in my job, just coasting by and pretty much doing the bare minimum that allowed me to be in peace with myself. Remote work increased my productivity and my hapiness ove…

135k is closer to 1% in the US than you’d think.

[deleted]

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#208

Post by rtlfe »

stolenmerch wrote: post #147
skulk wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He could've been a plumber/electrician/welder who would do really well in the current market. False. A plumber making $80k (US median seems to be around $60k) isn't going to be able to save up for a down payment if they're paying a typical mid-sized city's rent (~$1.2k a month). Not to mention housing costs going up during this period of saving up.

I honestly don't understand. When I bought a home I was literally making the US median income and bought an average priced house. My rent at the time was about a thousand a month. I had normal student loans and regular bills too. It wasn't easy but it didn't feel like a miracle either. Not saying someone making minimum can do this by any means, but there's a huge demand for labor in decent paying areas right now. I g…

> My rent at the time was about a thousand a month.

Sounds like this was either a long time ago or in city/town where not many people want to live.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#209

Post by immigrantheart »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #186
immigrantheart wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, could you elaborate? I'm not sure why I got downvoted, I genuinely curious how they are going to pay the bills.

I think before I elaborate too much I have to ask you a question: do you genuinely believe that most of Gen Z is actually refusing to work/is against the entire concept of working for pay?

No, I don't believe that.

Re: Gen Z does not dream of labor

#210

Post by StevePerkins »

skulk wrote: post #83
bufferoverflow wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this narrative is that the job of the father isn't specified. He could've been a plumber/electrician/welder who would do really well in the current market. These jobs pay well above the minimum wage. The world has changed - simple labor that requires a few days of training doesn't pay much. Most jobs, with few exceptions, that require a decade of training, do pay well. That's why there's such a huge…

> He could've been a plumber/electrician/welder who would do really well in the current market. False. A plumber making $80k (US median seems to be around $60k) isn't going to be able to save up for a down payment if they're paying a typical mid-sized city's rent (~$1.2k a month). Not to mention housing costs going up during this period of saving up.

Not to mention that plumber probably doesn't have health coverage. The people who love to talk about what a fine profession that would be (for other people's kids, of course, never their own kids) are the same people who fight tooth and nail against any kind of health care policy that might make a non-white collar career more viable.
Post reply on HN