Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube • Hacker News Board

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#201

Post by dr_kiszonka » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:40 PM UTC

kgwxd wrote: post #15

gameswithgo wrote: post #2

It is so dumb and twisted that there even needs to be a deal. Any web browser can hit youtube, you can probably get to youtube via a web browser anyway on a roku, if not they could in principle do that. Also dumb and twisted that as a paying youtube subscriber, I could buy a computer (a roku) and not be allowed to access youtube on it. Do better, tech.

I find it more annoying that standard websites don't just work on a Roku. I'd rather Google didn't have to maintain yet another app for yet another proprietary device, it should all just be build on open standards.

Agreed.

As a workaround, when a video provider is not supported on Roku, what I do is stream video directly from my Android phone to Roku using a free app which is available on both platforms. It is not as convenient as having a dedicated Roku app, but it works.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#202

Post by entropicdrifter » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:42 PM UTC

supernovae wrote: post #146

ethbr0 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a great example of what both companies see as their value proposition (to users, and to Wall Street). Roku: aggregating multiple streaming providers in a provider-agnostic way Google: centralizing streaming through the YouTube brand (considering it comprises multiple offerings now) I'm not a huge fan of Roku, due to data collection, but it's apparent who's on the side of the user here. Google/YouTube has finally…

NextDNS seems to block Roku's data collection efforts (as well as other "smart tvs")

My PiHole blocks the Roku data collection, too

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#203

Post by teh_klev » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:48 PM UTC

hristov wrote: post #174

tedajax wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure this refers to Roku's top level search which searches across all apps not the search inside the YouTube app.

Why are you pretty sure about that? From what I have read about it, it seems the argument is very much for search results within the youtube app.

From the Roku blog post:

First, Google continues to interfere with Roku’s independent search results, requiring that we preference YouTube over other content providers.

That's Roku's own search app Google are trying to influence.

https://www.roku.com/blog/en-gb/update-on-youtube-tv

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#204

Post by otterley » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:49 PM UTC

inetknght wrote: post #140

enobrev wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're absolutely right, this website works fine unless you deliberately disable it.

Websites, especially blogs, should work fine without javascript. There's no reason whatsoever to require javascript for a user to read a few paragraphs.

That war was lost 10 years ago. Sorry.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#205

Post by otterley » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:50 PM UTC

gameswithgo wrote: post #2

It is so dumb and twisted that there even needs to be a deal. Any web browser can hit youtube, you can probably get to youtube via a web browser anyway on a roku, if not they could in principle do that. Also dumb and twisted that as a paying youtube subscriber, I could buy a computer (a roku) and not be allowed to access youtube on it. Do better, tech.

Putting a full-fledged browser into a Roku device would require significantly more powerful hardware and would make it much more expensive as a result. There's also the question of what the UX would be. Let's not oversimplify the solution to complex business problems.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#206

Post by p_j_w » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:56 PM UTC

maxsilver wrote: post #48

015a wrote: post #40

This whole situation really feels like Google has their head stuck up their ass. People are just as likely to leave Roku, as they are to leave YouTube TV. Their subscriber numbers can't be strong enough to justify such idiotic behavior. To me, this sounds like a middle manager gone rogue, and no one higher up has stepped in yet and said "Ok, you shot your shot, but Roku called your bluff, you've taken this way too fa…

It's doubly weird, because YouTube TV is literally just a side project -- There's at least a 50% chance Google just totally shuts down YouTube TV within the next five years. (Like they already did with Google Play Music, and Google Play Movies + TV once before). Google's going to war with Roku over something that Google doesn't care about at all (it's one minor ancillary line of business to them), but is Roku's main…

>Like they already did with Google Play Music, and Google Play Movies + TV once before

GPM didn't get shut down, it got switched over to YTM. If you want to use that as an example for what might happen to YTTV, then it'd be YTTV getting moved over to an inferior rebrand that occupies the same space. And I don't know what you're talking about with Play Movies and TV. It's still there.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#207

Post by josefresco » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:57 PM UTC

dtjb wrote: post #18

I get this situation is different since YouTube is looking for concessions on functionality, but I find it hard to defend Roku with their triple-dipping scheme. They charge for the device (I paid over $100 for my 4k HDR box), then they display massive ads covering 50% of the screen, then they want a cut of revenue from content providers as well. Roku burned through a lot of goodwill with their customers during the HB…

> then they display massive ads covering 50% of the screen

Stop this. I have multiple Rokus. The % of time I spend on their menu looking at the ads is like 0.0001% of my total time using Roku. In fact, I didn't even notice any ads for months until someone on Reddit complained about it.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#208

Post by josefresco » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 5:59 PM UTC

whoknowswhat11 wrote: post #100

Funny seeing all the Roku love here. What I've observed when comparing Roku to other devices. I buy my apple TV -> I get basically no ads, they don't seem to charge that much to allow folks like youtube tv to have an app on the platform Roku -> I buy and own my device. They seem to sell advertising all over the device I paid for. They seem to be charging companies for buttons and/or to be able to put an app on the ro…

> hey seem to sell advertising all over the device I paid for.

The ads "all over the device" only appear on the menu and "screen saver" screen which represent a tiny fraction of my screen usage.

I turn on TV, I choose Netflix/YTTV/etc. and I'm off. Time spent looking at the ONE banner ad less than 1 second. It's not obtrusive, it's not "all over the device".

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#209

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 6:07 PM UTC

jeffbee wrote: post #89

judge2020 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From Roku's blog post, it seems that Google wants a dedicated area in the global search for YouTube results. For example, If you search for "Last Week Tonight", Google wants a YouTube results row showing clips on their service above results from other content platforms like HBO Max. Basically, Google wants to have the placement that search ads get on their platform on Roku. Previous discussions[0] suggested that it…

LG WebOS has a YouTube TV app and the search button in the remote takes you to the global search function. This doesn’t seem to cause any friction between google and LG. Because YouTube TV seems to work everywhere but on roku I tend to blame roku here.

To my knowledge, LG hasn't implied that they want a piece of YouTube's revenue, while the Roku executive team has hinted that capturing some of the revenue from the streaming services is one of their long term goals.

I suspect YouTube's dealmakers think Roku are being sticklers to try to extract a small financial concession, and they're afraid that if they give an inch, it'll open the floodgates and everyone will want a piece of their revenue.

Re: Roku tells customers it is unable to strike a deal with YouTube

#210

Post by nitrogen » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 6:18 PM UTC

pkulak wrote: post #188

jefftk wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A raspberry pi 4 will, and the accessories are relatively cheap: https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/build-the-ultimate-4k-home-...

I'm still seeing $65 for the Pi, then adding up everything else you need takes you over $100 easily.

These accessories are sold in quantities of one, to consumers, and made in relatively smaller batches. All of that gets a lot cheaper if you can injection mold a plastic housing and buy things in hundreds of thousands or millions.