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'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

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Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#201

Post by 01100011 »

Vrondi wrote: post #196
01100011 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I genuinely don't understand people who aren't willing to learn this stuff even if they pay someone else to do it As a rich guy I knew used to say, do what you do best, and give away all the rest. I spent my 30s doing all the things you mentioned and more. There was some joy in it, I will admit, but I am vastly less wealthy than if I had focused on my consulting business and learned how to negotiate and supervise t…

If I didn't do it myself, it wouldn't be done. Not everyone has the option of hiring everything done.

If you have nothing better to do with your time then go ahead! It can be a fine choice in many situations. For many HN types whose time is far more valuable than many tradespeople, it is a financially reckless choice.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#202

Post by [deleted] »

jxramos wrote: post #167
tylerjwilk00 wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is happening where I live. Previously huge tracks of mountain and forest are slowly being cut up. However, it's the rich newcomers that are selfish with their land. When we were children we had ATVs/dirtbikes and could put in hundred miles a day of riding. Now many trails have gates and no trespassing signs. Used to be a sense of shared commonwealth amongst connected properties. Now, it's the "privatization" of…

Where do these parcel divisions get recorded exactly? I thought it would be a really fascinating open data source record to capture all the timelines of land being divvied up and sold and when houses get built through some map timelapse videos.

[deleted]

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#203

Post by 01100011 »

bumby wrote: post #193
01100011 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I genuinely don't understand people who aren't willing to learn this stuff even if they pay someone else to do it As a rich guy I knew used to say, do what you do best, and give away all the rest. I spent my 30s doing all the things you mentioned and more. There was some joy in it, I will admit, but I am vastly less wealthy than if I had focused on my consulting business and learned how to negotiate and supervise t…

Specialization is the nature of capitalism so what you say is true. However, not everybody has the aim to optimize "getting ahead in life" in terms of accumulating the most material wealth. A propos of the linked article, I know people in the high desert former-frontier whose ideal retirement is running a lodge or campground, constantly working as a general handyman. To them, that hits on many of the things necessary…

And they'll say that until that wealth could have done something useful for them, like defend their freedoms from encroachment or promote causes they find valuable.

Wealth is worth far more than fancy cars and fine clothing. I couldn't give a shit about expensive material possessions but I think that only an utter fool would disavow themselves of wealth. Don't be conned into thinking wealth is synonymous with frivolous, ostentatious displays and vanity.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#204

Post by microtherion »

phobosanomaly wrote: post #51

In many parts of the United States when you call 911, you're lucky if anyone shows up within an hour. It's a couple hours to get to a Wal-Mart or a store. It's difficult to get anyone to drive 40 minutes outside the nearest town and navigate unmarked dirt roads to do basic plumbing or home repairs. As a result, people have to learn to repair things, make things, use a gun, do first aid, lay shingles, hang drywall, po…

> In many parts of the United States when you call 911, you're lucky if anyone shows up within an hour.

And not necessarily only rural parts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPNK0VspQ0M

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#205

Post by prewett »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #57
XaspR8d wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I try to avoid "midwest" at all, except when being vague is a goal. The distinction between "Great Lakes" & "Great Plains" seems quite useful both geographically and culturally and "midwest" seems to just splotch right over that boundary. I agree with your western boundary, though I'd probably just call it "The Rockies" myself, and let Nevadans and Utahns get absorbed either into "West Coast" or "Southwest" as t…

Utah is not West Coast. As rosseloh said, it's the West. (And I agree - I draw the line at Denver.) I don't agree with "Midwest" where people place it on the east side, though. Take Pittsburgh, for instance. Look at a map , people. It's not "west", and it's not even "mid". It's East. "Mid" starts at Chicago. (Pittsburgh was once midwest, but it's not 1870 any more.)

I think the term "midwest" came from back when "West" meant "west" of the Mississippi. Ohio, is definitely not East, and definitely not West, but is pretty mid-west from that perspective.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#206

Post by 01100011 »

cycloptic wrote: post #184
01100011 wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I genuinely don't understand people who aren't willing to learn this stuff even if they pay someone else to do it As a rich guy I knew used to say, do what you do best, and give away all the rest. I spent my 30s doing all the things you mentioned and more. There was some joy in it, I will admit, but I am vastly less wealthy than if I had focused on my consulting business and learned how to negotiate and supervise t…

I think you are conflating things. The idea I see behind most self-reliance is that it significantly reduces the amount of wealth needed to accomplish everyday tasks. Following that, you wouldn't see much of a need for those do-it-yourself types to accumulate wealth just for the sake of doing so.

If only we didn't live in a world of property taxes...

Wealth should not be sneered at. Wealth buys a new well for your farm. Wealth buys you tools to expand your capabilities. Wealth allows you to exploit the capabilities of society to accomplish things beyond yourself. Do you want to preserve gun or property rights so you can continue to live a self-reliant lifestyle? That takes wealth(or you can cop-out and let other people do it for you).

I am well aware of the saying "sell your time to buy the time that other people sold", but that cynically omits the benefits of comparative advantage. Most HN readers time is far more valuable than a plumber or carpenter.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#207

Post by Zak »

whatshisface wrote: post #199
Zak wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up in Alaska, and I think I disagree in a philosophical sense. There's a lot of stuff hacked together in ways experts in the relevant fields would certainly not find beautiful. Expanding foam is probably not in the toolkit of very many master architects; most people have never read an electrical code (and in many places, there's no entity imposing one); many boats, snowmobiles, and other vehicles have been ada…

Just as long as the romance is tempered with the reality of the occasional house-fire.

It is, but those usually stem from the need for heat in the extreme cold, which is often achieved by the old fashioned method of burning wood in a stove.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#208

Post by greyswan »

Johnny555 wrote: post #143
phobosanomaly wrote: post #51

In many parts of the United States when you call 911, you're lucky if anyone shows up within an hour. It's a couple hours to get to a Wal-Mart or a store. It's difficult to get anyone to drive 40 minutes outside the nearest town and navigate unmarked dirt roads to do basic plumbing or home repairs. As a result, people have to learn to repair things, make things, use a gun, do first aid, lay shingles, hang drywall, po…

My nephew lives in a very isolated rural area on the east coast and I think you're overselling the "people in the community learn emergency medicine" part - he has no idea how to handle much more than stopping bleeding for a cut (his answer to any size cut is to slather it with antibiotic ointment, which the doctors then have to scrub out before they can suture) or maybe stabilizing a broken leg enough to move someon…

I genuinely enjoyed your story about your nephew, but it's bit like telling an anecdote about an incompetent engineer and then saying there isn't a large number of engineers that are good at solving problems.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#209

Post by bumby »

01100011 wrote: post #203
bumby wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Specialization is the nature of capitalism so what you say is true. However, not everybody has the aim to optimize "getting ahead in life" in terms of accumulating the most material wealth. A propos of the linked article, I know people in the high desert former-frontier whose ideal retirement is running a lodge or campground, constantly working as a general handyman. To them, that hits on many of the things necessary…

And they'll say that until that wealth could have done something useful for them, like defend their freedoms from encroachment or promote causes they find valuable. Wealth is worth far more than fancy cars and fine clothing. I couldn't give a shit about expensive material possessions but I think that only an utter fool would disavow themselves of wealth . Don't be conned into thinking wealth is synonymous with frivol…

You hit the nail on the head. Wealth isn’t about loving green pieces of paper. It’s about the freedom it provides. But from his place, he’s already doing exactly what he wants. There’s literally nothing he wants more than what he has. Now maybe that would change if his health is constrained, but as it stands he spends everyday exactly how he would spend his weekends if he was working at a 9-5.

That freedom of time is all that money can ultimately provide in the best sense. However, amassing wealth by moving away from that is definitely counter-productive. Wealth is just a means to an end; if the end is already at hand it provides little to no marginal utility.

Re: 'Wild West' mentality lingers in modern populations of US mountain regions

#210

Post by AdrianB1 »

01100011 wrote: post #178
noir_lord wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much the same, I can re-wire a house (factory actually though it's been a long time since I trained as an industrial sparks), plaster, do basic joinery, plumbing, tiling, engine/motorcycle maintenance (I do my motorcycle and rebuilt scramblers when I was a kid), weld (not done it for a long time but it'd come back), sheet metal work etc all to a reasonable or better standard. I've never lived out in the countr…

> I genuinely don't understand people who aren't willing to learn this stuff even if they pay someone else to do it As a rich guy I knew used to say, do what you do best, and give away all the rest. I spent my 30s doing all the things you mentioned and more. There was some joy in it, I will admit, but I am vastly less wealthy than if I had focused on my consulting business and learned how to negotiate and supervise t…

I can afford to pay others to help, but at the same time I know how to do myself 90% of what I need. That means I can fix something that breaks at midnight and have a professional do a permanent fix, if needed, in the morning. I can also fix by motorcycle or mountain bike when it breaks in the middle of the mountains 20 miles from the closest village, calling for help is many times not an option due to lack of phone signal. Yes, it is nice to do only what you do best, but it's not a good idea to be ignorant of skills that may be essential sometimes.
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