Live data from Hacker News

Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

arxiv.org

21–30 of 31 posts

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#21
post #5
post #4

I felt sad when I finally completed Braid. It's still one of the best games I've ever played and I knew I was never going to find something like that again. This paper brought me back to that sense of wonder that I had the first time I played Braid.

That very last stage stands in my memory as one of the best uses of game mechanics as part of the story telling I've ever seen. It's the rare sort of thing that truly makes games an art of its own, rather than some sort of "interactive movie".

Ludonarrative resonance. It's fun to see the critical/theory sphere develop alongside the medium. We sometimes forget just how young videos games are. Compared to film, they're completely in their infancy, and narrative film isn't even 100 years old yet.

I can't think of many other games where the mechanics themselves reinforce the story. Papers, Please does it pretty well.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#22
post #21
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That very last stage stands in my memory as one of the best uses of game mechanics as part of the story telling I've ever seen. It's the rare sort of thing that truly makes games an art of its own, rather than some sort of "interactive movie".

Ludonarrative resonance. It's fun to see the critical/theory sphere develop alongside the medium. We sometimes forget just how young videos games are. Compared to film, they're completely in their infancy, and narrative film isn't even 100 years old yet. I can't think of many other games where the mechanics themselves reinforce the story. Papers, Please does it pretty well.

Brothers - A Tale of Two Sons is another example.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#23
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ludonarrative resonance. It's fun to see the critical/theory sphere develop alongside the medium. We sometimes forget just how young videos games are. Compared to film, they're completely in their infancy, and narrative film isn't even 100 years old yet. I can't think of many other games where the mechanics themselves reinforce the story. Papers, Please does it pretty well.

Brothers - A Tale of Two Sons is another example.

Yeah. The phantom limb sort of sensation was surprisingly powerful.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#24
post #6

Jonathan Blow, creator of Braid, is coming out with a new game called "The Witness" pretty Soon™. http://the-witness.net/news/

Yes, it's set to be released in mid-2014.

It was delayed, as games often are. The latest progress report was on May 5, 2015.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#26
post #4

I felt sad when I finally completed Braid. It's still one of the best games I've ever played and I knew I was never going to find something like that again. This paper brought me back to that sense of wonder that I had the first time I played Braid.

Braid was fun, but it didn't tie together very well. The mechanics are disjointed. From an artistic point of view, Limbo outshines Braid.

I've replayed Limbo, but never Braid.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, decidable is a much higher level. A problem is decidable if it can ever be solved by any computer, given as much time as it wants. The classic undecidable problem is "the halting problem". In short, given a computer program (and some input for it), decide if that program will ever stop, or continue forever. It turns out there is NO WAY to write a program which will, for any input program, check if it will halt…

A simple summary is: a problem domain is decidable if there exists an algorithm that will always be able to tell you true or false if any problem in that domain is solvable. Some examples of this are propositional logic and linear logic are decidable, whereas the halting problem and nonlinear logic are not. For instance, the halting problem isn't decidable because although you can answer true or false for some specif…

To be pedantic: the Halting Problem for Turing Machines is undecidable. There are simpler computing models for which we can decide halting.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#28
post #26
post #4

I felt sad when I finally completed Braid. It's still one of the best games I've ever played and I knew I was never going to find something like that again. This paper brought me back to that sense of wonder that I had the first time I played Braid.

Braid was fun, but it didn't tie together very well. The mechanics are disjointed. From an artistic point of view, Limbo outshines Braid. I've replayed Limbo, but never Braid.

Gotta disagree with you there. IMO Limbo was mostly polish with little substance (and don't get me wrong, I think it does a great job at that, it has amazing aesthetics).

FWIW I've revisited Braid multiple times, but don't think I'd get anything new out of Limbo if I played through it again.

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#29
post #25
post #6

Jonathan Blow, creator of Braid, is coming out with a new game called "The Witness" pretty Soon™. http://the-witness.net/news/

Jonathan Blow is also working on Jai, a programming language for game developers. https://inductive.no/jai/

Oh, it has a website and a name now, cool!

PS: the usual recommendation is to build a game not an engine, I guess nobody have foreseen an experienced developer going even lower in abstraction :). One of these days: "I am not satisfied with the hardware we have, where is my soldering iron..."

Re: Braid is undecidable (2014) [pdf]

#30
post #28
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Braid was fun, but it didn't tie together very well. The mechanics are disjointed. From an artistic point of view, Limbo outshines Braid. I've replayed Limbo, but never Braid.

Gotta disagree with you there. IMO Limbo was mostly polish with little substance (and don't get me wrong, I think it does a great job at that, it has amazing aesthetics). FWIW I've revisited Braid multiple times, but don't think I'd get anything new out of Limbo if I played through it again.

To make a broader statement: I can count on one hand the times I've played Limbo and Braid. I don't have enough appendages for Spelunky.
Post reply on HN