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How to do a startup in your spare time

blog.bellebethcooper.com

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Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#21

Post by espinchi »

rst wrote: post #18
pc86 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the author but I've done something similar before, so here's what I can offer: > What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? My boss had no reason to know, although she eventually found out through other means. It didn't affect my day job at all so it was a non-issue. I had no reason to bring it up and neither did she. > How much do you talk about it at work? Not at all. Work is for work. > Are you worr…

FWIW, some folks may have employment contracts with $dayjob which give that company intellectual property claims on all technical work by employees whether done on or off the job. The extent of those claims obviously depends on the contract itself, and enforceability varies by jurisdiction. (California is better on this than most US States, but even there, employers with a will may have enough wiggle room to make tro…

About this type of clauses, I've heard that "well, they are standard and are almost always ignored, as long as you don't cross the line (e.g. code for your side-projects in your day-job office)".

I know this depends on the company, but, as a general rule, are these clauses really taken so lightly?

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#22

Post by visakanv »

startupjerkfest wrote: post #19
edw519 wrote: post #13

Sorry to say but this post really rubbed me the wrong way. Let me explain... Her important headings for "doing a startup in your spare time": - Managing tasks - Sharing links - Talking to other founders - Emailing customers - Blogging - Weekly catch-ups All of this stuff sounds nice, but face it, it's all fluff. We really need to talk about the elephant in the room, the single most important item in a part time start…

Ed, you have the power of experience, and your suggestions are all good. But I can't figure out why you even bothered to comment about her posting. If you had to "educate" every startup hipster on what is wrong with their self aggrandizing blog posts, you would never have time to produce anything. Were you afraid other founders would take her musing as "law" and ruin their lives? I think the less attention these inte…

Well, if it helps, I feel like I learnt something from reading both of your thoughts on this. Thanks.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#23

Post by pc86 »

rst wrote: post #18
pc86 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the author but I've done something similar before, so here's what I can offer: > What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? My boss had no reason to know, although she eventually found out through other means. It didn't affect my day job at all so it was a non-issue. I had no reason to bring it up and neither did she. > How much do you talk about it at work? Not at all. Work is for work. > Are you worr…

FWIW, some folks may have employment contracts with $dayjob which give that company intellectual property claims on all technical work by employees whether done on or off the job. The extent of those claims obviously depends on the contract itself, and enforceability varies by jurisdiction. (California is better on this than most US States, but even there, employers with a will may have enough wiggle room to make tro…

I wholeheartedly agree. I don’t mean to suggest an ignorance is bliss approach, only that if you employer does not have a need to know, you don’t need to go parading around that your employment there has an expiration date of your side project’s profitability.

As for those types of contracts assigning tech IP to $dayjob, that’s what I was alluding to. If you have one of those, unfortunately you cannot start a business without risking $dayjob wanting a piece (or all of it). Regardless of how often they stand up in court or are even tentatively enforced, I wouldn’t want to risk it.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#24

Post by sailfast »

mooreds wrote: post #16
soneca wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much more worthy set of questions. I quit my job a year ago, learn to code a little, build some projects, and for 3 months I've been a full-time founder. But now I have to pay the bills (and still no traction), so I will start a day-job. But before that, I founded a startup while at my last day-job. It was kind of unique, as my boss didn't have any problem at all with it, even allowing me to work on it during work ho…

Great advice, but: "- Talk as little as possible. Even if you have a very transparent, honest relationship with you boss. If your boss might find detrimental you to have a startup, don't talk at all." I think it is better to talk about the possibility of a startup on your own time during the interview process. This has the side effect of filtering out jobs with controlling bosses. (You may not have this luxury, thoug…

Agreed on the communication side - on my end from an integrity perspective it was important to be completely up front about the situation. Also critical because of possible intellectual property concerns down the road. Note: This could cause problems including a "stop work" guideline from your employer, but I preferred to cause the problems up front so I could handle them effectively and keep things transparent.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#25

Post by etsimm »

espinchi wrote: post #21
rst wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, some folks may have employment contracts with $dayjob which give that company intellectual property claims on all technical work by employees whether done on or off the job. The extent of those claims obviously depends on the contract itself, and enforceability varies by jurisdiction. (California is better on this than most US States, but even there, employers with a will may have enough wiggle room to make tro…

About this type of clauses, I've heard that "well, they are standard and are almost always ignored, as long as you don't cross the line (e.g. code for your side-projects in your day-job office)". I know this depends on the company, but, as a general rule, are these clauses really taken so lightly?

I was running the engineering group of a VC backed firm when the side project a couple of my people were working on nights & weekends got some great press coverage. By the time it hit TC the Engineers' names were there along with a quote about how their work was supported by their "day job" ... Our VCs took notice and our boilerplate employee PIIA was trotted out to claim rights to the side project. The project was completely unrelated to our line of business BTW...but it didn't matter as the VCs smelled IP value in the press exposure.

I fought the good fight against some silly assertions such as "They could not have built this in so little time without overlapping working hours" but lost the battle when the VCs pointed to the timestamps of some support/feedback comments posted by one of my Engineers on the project's website. He had written those and posted during working hours while sitting in the office of said "day job"

Project squashed, all the IP was rolled up and shelved. It was a bad day.

TL;DR these clauses are typically not enforced because your side project is typically viewed as worthless. If on the other hand your project is seen as a source of value... tread carefully.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#26

Post by wehadfun »

pc86 wrote: post #12
SandB0x wrote: post #3

I have a list of concerns and questions as I am doing something similar. Would be interested to see what you make of it: What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? How much do you talk about it at work? Are you worried that your full-time employer will think you're doing your work on their time? Are you worried that you may be technically doing your work on their computers (even by logging into Asana or a…

Not the author but I've done something similar before, so here's what I can offer: > What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? My boss had no reason to know, although she eventually found out through other means. It didn't affect my day job at all so it was a non-issue. I had no reason to bring it up and neither did she. > How much do you talk about it at work? Not at all. Work is for work. > Are you worr…

Really we need a way to join forces. You can't do it alone. I was able to crank out a barely working software project on the side when I was 23 but now I don't have as much free time. I would love for us to post "Join Me HN: " on here and maybe some of us 9-5 ers can get it on the action.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#27

Post by drakaal »

Doing a startup in your spare time is a good way to get fired. It is also a good way to ruin your good idea.

Part time startups work only if you are trying to start a "home business" that is very different from you day job.

You work at Best Buy, and want to start a new search engine. Great. That is better than quitting you job to start a new search engine.

You work at Google and want to start a social network. You are going to get fired. There is a good chance Google will own your code, and you won't have enough time to get your social network off the ground, so now you are doubly screwed.

You work at Google and want to start a business selling Clay ovens on the weekend. Congrats you have a startup that won't break Google's moonlighting rules.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#28

Post by drakaal »

soneca wrote: post #11
SandB0x wrote: post #3

I have a list of concerns and questions as I am doing something similar. Would be interested to see what you make of it: What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? How much do you talk about it at work? Are you worried that your full-time employer will think you're doing your work on their time? Are you worried that you may be technically doing your work on their computers (even by logging into Asana or a…

Much more worthy set of questions. I quit my job a year ago, learn to code a little, build some projects, and for 3 months I've been a full-time founder. But now I have to pay the bills (and still no traction), so I will start a day-job. But before that, I founded a startup while at my last day-job. It was kind of unique, as my boss didn't have any problem at all with it, even allowing me to work on it during work ho…

Congrats, you managed to outline a scenario in which there will be no doubt that your day job will own your startup. Talk to a lawyer, you need transparency in 40 of 50 states so that you can document what IP of the startup isn't the company's.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#29

Post by agon »

rst wrote: post #18
pc86 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the author but I've done something similar before, so here's what I can offer: > What does your boss/supervisor think of your startup? My boss had no reason to know, although she eventually found out through other means. It didn't affect my day job at all so it was a non-issue. I had no reason to bring it up and neither did she. > How much do you talk about it at work? Not at all. Work is for work. > Are you worr…

FWIW, some folks may have employment contracts with $dayjob which give that company intellectual property claims on all technical work by employees whether done on or off the job. The extent of those claims obviously depends on the contract itself, and enforceability varies by jurisdiction. (California is better on this than most US States, but even there, employers with a will may have enough wiggle room to make tro…

Exactly, when I started looking into doing a few side projects for some extra scratch I went to my employer and had them draft up a letter explicitly releasing me to do side projects as long as it doesn't affect my work or their customers.

Re: How to do a startup in your spare time

#30

Post by AznHisoka »

drakaal wrote: post #27

Doing a startup in your spare time is a good way to get fired. It is also a good way to ruin your good idea. Part time startups work only if you are trying to start a "home business" that is very different from you day job. You work at Best Buy, and want to start a new search engine. Great. That is better than quitting you job to start a new search engine. You work at Google and want to start a social network. You ar…

For the vast majority of people, their startups/side projects are vastly diff. than their day job.
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