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US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

bloomberg.com

21–30 of 193 posts

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#21

Tariffs are just a mechanism to adjust the calculus of where something is made. Consumers getting Nd:YAG lasers from China below cost are also weakening the laser supply chain elsewhere. Tariffs are a type of response to these situations.

What are you talking about? These tariffs are used to combat the influx of fentanyl from China, Canada, and Penguin Island.

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#22
post #12

Tariffs are supposed to change consumer behavior. What's next? Is Bloomberg going to be telling us that fluoridation is preventing tooth demineralization and not actually helping the Communists?

The President and his followers think that Tariffs are something foreigners pay. And they still think that.

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would take many years for production to meaningfully ramp up, but there absolutely is a lot of land in California that could be used to grow avocados if it made economic sense.

So, on to the next example: Brazilian coffee.

Technically Hawaii and maybe Puerto Rico.

But those areas don't have anywhere close to the land of Brazil, Columbia or Vietnam.

--------

Another example: bauxite ore (Australia is our chief partner in that IIRC). USA somehow is missing the raw ore for Aluminum despite nearly everyone else in the world having it.

There's lots of things we can't make

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#24

Tariffs are just a mechanism to adjust the calculus of where something is made. Consumers getting Nd:YAG lasers from China below cost are also weakening the laser supply chain elsewhere. Tariffs are a type of response to these situations.

Why do you argue with 'below cost'?

If you mean that we exploit Chinese people by not giving them the proper salary, living standard and retirement fund, yeah true

But parallel to that, automatization has reached a level we never had before.

I don't think tarifs would lead to more capital in USA in the right/expected pockets.

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#25
post #15

"Not Foreign Companies"? They can both pay. Taxes are negative-sum.

They will not. Because the sellers can sell to another country without the tariff. American buyers have no alternative.

American buyers are the pretty girl, because they are in debt up to their ears and constantly taking out more. There's no secret alternative to the American market that everybody was ignoring until tariffs. Everybody else will be getting stuff cheap for a while because countries that are hit with tariffs will have too much production capacity, but those won't be profitable sales.

American buyers, however, can buy their products from anyone in the world. They can choose to buy domestically, or to import from countries that have lower tariffs.

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, on to the next example: Brazilian coffee.

Technically Hawaii and maybe Puerto Rico. But those areas don't have anywhere close to the land of Brazil, Columbia or Vietnam. -------- Another example: bauxite ore (Australia is our chief partner in that IIRC). USA somehow is missing the raw ore for Aluminum despite nearly everyone else in the world having it. There's lots of things we can't make

Correct, I know that coffee is grown on Hawaii, but it simply doesn't have the land area at the right altitude necessary to do so at the required scale.

Something not quite the same, but parallel is happening with Florida oranges:

> Only 12m boxes of oranges will have been produced in Florida by the end of this year (2024), ... The figure is 33% lower than a year ago, and less than 5% of the 2004 harvest of 242m boxes.

> It is also dwarfed by the 378m boxes expected to be produced this year in Brazil

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/dec/22/florida-oran...

Re: US companies, consumers are paying for tariffs, not foreign firms

#27

A reminder, most tariffs will not be paid because consumers will just shift their spending habits to match or just buy less. Tariffs are a double edged sword because the hurt purchasing power of consumers without really generating much money for the government. The administration is going to focus on the fact that tariffs don't really drive inflation, but are going to miss the forest for the trees: prices won't go up…

I don't think that's quite right.

Here's a thing with a punitive tariff on it. People won't buy it because the price went up too much. It is because prices went up that nobody buys it. (And we all become poorer because we can afford less, whether or not the price increase shows up in the inflation statistics.)

Tariffs have their own Laffer Curve just like income taxes do. Sure, you can set them so that the government gets zero (or close) revenue. But you don't have to. You can set them so that the government gets quite a bit of money. (Note well: I am not claiming that Trump is setting them there.)

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