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ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

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21–30 of 163 posts

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#21
post #5

Is it just me, or has the ACLU been on a roll lately? I'm really enjoying its current direction. It might have just been that the most controversial headlines were getting the most airtime, but it seemed to be going off the tracks for a while.

When was the ACLU going off the tracks exactly?

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#22
post #5

Is it just me, or has the ACLU been on a roll lately? I'm really enjoying its current direction. It might have just been that the most controversial headlines were getting the most airtime, but it seemed to be going off the tracks for a while.

When was the ACLU going off the tracks exactly?

After giving up on Gilmore v. Gonzales, in my opinion.

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#23
post #14
post #12

Stingray use requires a warrant and every case should be dismissed where one was used without a warrant. I'm sure that's the main reason they want to hide the use of stingrays, they know they're doing something wrong. Police having the ability to spy on everyone with little to no oversight is nightmarish authoritarianism, it's completely against the spirit of American democracy, not to mention in violation of The Con…

The problem is knowing a Stingray was ever used in the first place. It's been documented that the police routinely utilize parallel construction when they discover things through illegal means in the first place. https://www.wired.com/story/stingray-secret-surveillance-pro...

The tv show The Wire was a documentary after all.

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#24
Some informed person can probably tell us: are there any technical developments on the horizon which could plausibly make stingrays unviable? From a lay perspective, it seems like cell tech hasn't been designed to meet some criteria that ought to be achievable.

- Are there future cell technology standards being planned which would make it harder for a 3rd party device to impersonate a cell tower? (e.g. the police would actively need the cell network to help them sign something)

- Why can't we encrypt calls and texts in a way which doesn't let all this stuff get read? Like (handwaving) either trust the network and encrypt with a key they provide, or else some form end-to-end encryption (where maybe generating keys is part of what happens when you activate a sim card or something)?

Like, sure the lawsuits are important, but why did we end up with a system where these tools are possible?

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#26
post #12

Stingray use requires a warrant and every case should be dismissed where one was used without a warrant. I'm sure that's the main reason they want to hide the use of stingrays, they know they're doing something wrong. Police having the ability to spy on everyone with little to no oversight is nightmarish authoritarianism, it's completely against the spirit of American democracy, not to mention in violation of The Con…

But even when they have a warrant to go after one person, the fact that they can scoop up information from everyone else even remotely near that person, and those people never find out is pretty abusive.

Like, if my neighbor is a drug dealer, and the police get a warrant to search their apartment, maybe that's reasonable. If they use that warrant to search every apartment on my block, that's messed up. If they do that without leaving a trace, so I have no idea when or if it has happened ... then I'm living in a panopticon.

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#28
post #24

Some informed person can probably tell us: are there any technical developments on the horizon which could plausibly make stingrays unviable? From a lay perspective, it seems like cell tech hasn't been designed to meet some criteria that ought to be achievable. - Are there future cell technology standards being planned which would make it harder for a 3rd party device to impersonate a cell tower? (e.g. the police wou…

Since the FCC sanctions stingray use for law enforcement I'm sure they make sure that any new mobile radio technology is compliant with police spying requirements.

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#29
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When was the ACLU going off the tracks exactly?

After giving up on Gilmore v. Gonzales , in my opinion.

I just did a quick read here. What options are there for their case? They tried to escalate to the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court was not interested. Where do you go from there? (note: Am Canadian, curious about it hypothetically)

Re: ACLU sues Homeland Security over 'stingray' cell phone surveillance

#30
post #24

Some informed person can probably tell us: are there any technical developments on the horizon which could plausibly make stingrays unviable? From a lay perspective, it seems like cell tech hasn't been designed to meet some criteria that ought to be achievable. - Are there future cell technology standards being planned which would make it harder for a 3rd party device to impersonate a cell tower? (e.g. the police wou…

5G is by nature shorter range, which at least makes the surveillance harder to do and more targeted when it happens. But I can't say much for the protocol, having not done much with it.
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