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Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

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Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#21

Post by throw20102010 »

dx034 wrote: post #7

So how long will it take until Asian Phone companies using Android get together to develop an alternative Android ecosystem? They could set it up in a neutral nation with profits going to all companies. So far, these always failed because it was only one company involved (e.g. Amazons app store) but will all major manufacturers involved, it would be much more profitable for developers to be on that app store than on…

Most Chinese versions of Android are completely de-Googled[1]- no Play store, no Maps, no GMail, etc. They have their own app store, web browser, and everything else. They are still based on Android, but it's not a stretch to think that most Chinese phone manufacturers could fork the open source project tomorrow.

As soon as Google goes too far against the Chinese government, the manufacturers will receive a notice that Android is no longer welcome as an operating system and they will flip the switch. Most Chinese citizens wouldn't care or even notice.

Other Asian companies are working on alternative OSes in case Google ever "pulls a Google" and kills off Android. Samsung has Tizen, which sucks, but could be better with some work.

[1] I bought a Xiaomi phone with a Chinese ROM and it took three days to get unlock permissions from Xiaomi to put the Global ROM on it that had Google apps. In that time I didn't feel like I was missing anything huge- except for being able to get directions since the maps app didn't have US street maps.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#22

Post by disiplus »

rqs wrote: post #18
dx034 wrote: post #7

So how long will it take until Asian Phone companies using Android get together to develop an alternative Android ecosystem? They could set it up in a neutral nation with profits going to all companies. So far, these always failed because it was only one company involved (e.g. Amazons app store) but will all major manufacturers involved, it would be much more profitable for developers to be on that app store than on…

I could go one step further: Build another open source OS that can run Android app but not Android. Many Chinese companies already tried it (non-open source though) before but been persuaded not to, I guess they're feeling a little bit different now. The good part is, by building that OS, the domestic tech communities could receive a huge boost. So far for Huawei, Google's blockage is partly useless. As long as Huawe…

as somebody that bought an huawei device from a carrier, if carriers wont sell your devices you are just like dead. and i cannot imagine carriers selling devices that need to sideload google play and stuff.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#23

Post by bad_user »

And this is the danger of having so much power concentrated in a single country.

Google might not want to do this, but they might need to, because they are a US company.

Unfortunately this affects everyone. Why should Europeans care about US’s trade wars?

And don’t get me wrong, I would never buy Huawei devices because they are made by a company owned by a communist party, but that’s my choice to make, not that of some random US government that will be remembered as one of the worst ones yet.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#24

Post by throw20102010 »

zmmmmm wrote: post #5

They don't seem to be doing a very good job of communicating whether this is voluntary or mandated by the trade sanctions. It would seem to be terribly damaging to Google and Android if they can't convince OEMs that this is something extraordinary that no other OEM will need to worry about.

Android has cryptography in it for app signing and secure logins and such. Crypto is a real sensitive subject for export, even fairly standard implementations like what Android has. I'll bet that once the question is raised with government officials they will say that Google licensing crypto to (or just trusting certs from) Huawei is a hard no.

It would be real hard to make the Play store useful if you take away its main feature of getting trusted versions of apps. Ditto for most of Google's other products in Android.

Edit: For those of you who disagree with me, check out what happens now that Huawei is on the entity list (https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/lists-of-p...). Most notable is that they are now subject to "license requirements are independent of, and in addition to, license requirements imposed elsewhere in the EAR." Even if Android is deemed no license required (NLR) to every other person in the world, the US government can still prohibit Google from licensing Android to Huawei. If you don't think that the government would use a petty excuse such as [easily available] crypto to deny the license, then you obviously haven't dealt with the government enough. The US government was treating crypto the same as nuclear technology up until the year 2000, and they would still prefer if US companies didn't give out source code on the internet. This isn't a bunch of forward thinking Silicon Valley types making the judgement call, it's a bunch of bureaucrats in suits that don't understand how the internet works.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#25

Post by petecox »

sigmar wrote: post #15
gonvaled wrote: post #3

Does this apply to phones being currently sold? If I buy today the Huawei P30 Pro, in amazon.de, will I have (and keep) access to Google services?

my (well-informed but not expert) opinion is that you'll be able to use google services and the play store indefinitely, but that phone will not receive any more _system_ updates that maintain access to google services (since any android update w/ services baked in require google's cts and vts certification, which they will no longer perform for Huawei)

So a Huawei phone will be stuck on Android Pie, since any upgrade to the forthcoming Q release requires re-certification?

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#26

Post by jbk »

The Play Store and current Play Services, on the existing devices, sure.

Anything else, including OS security updates (the security they talk about is Play Protect, not updates), or new major versions of Android (Q) for existing devices, or other services that need hardware integration (wallet/pay?) is probably out of the question.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#28

Post by enedil »

throw20102010 wrote: post #24
zmmmmm wrote: post #5

They don't seem to be doing a very good job of communicating whether this is voluntary or mandated by the trade sanctions. It would seem to be terribly damaging to Google and Android if they can't convince OEMs that this is something extraordinary that no other OEM will need to worry about.

Android has cryptography in it for app signing and secure logins and such. Crypto is a real sensitive subject for export, even fairly standard implementations like what Android has. I'll bet that once the question is raised with government officials they will say that Google licensing crypto to (or just trusting certs from) Huawei is a hard no. It would be real hard to make the Play store useful if you take away its…

Cryptography used in these products have been public for years.

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#29

Post by FrankSansC »

gonvaled wrote: post #3

Does this apply to phones being currently sold? If I buy today the Huawei P30 Pro, in amazon.de, will I have (and keep) access to Google services?

Phones like the P30 Pro come in various versions : Europe (VOG-L29), International (VOG-L04),... and China (VOG-LT00). From what I've read on some forums the one for China don't have any Google services (+ no SafetyNet).

Re: Google confirms Play store will continue to function for existing Huawei phones

#30

Post by throw20102010 »

enedil wrote: post #28
throw20102010 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android has cryptography in it for app signing and secure logins and such. Crypto is a real sensitive subject for export, even fairly standard implementations like what Android has. I'll bet that once the question is raised with government officials they will say that Google licensing crypto to (or just trusting certs from) Huawei is a hard no. It would be real hard to make the Play store useful if you take away its…

Cryptography used in these products have been public for years.

Just because it's publicly available doesn't mean the US government won't try to embargo it. The government does silly things all the time.

The book "No Easy Day" became a New York Times best seller as soon as it was published (it's written by the SEAL that allegedly shot Osama bin Laden). The Department of Defense threatened to revoke the security clearances of military members that read the book because it contained classified details. It took a few weeks before they walked back their threats, because somehow nobody at the top realized how stupid it was to revoke security clearances over reading a bestselling public book.

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