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Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

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Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#21

Post by Amezarak »

vkou wrote: post #20
danblick wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying, "prove it has happened" or "prove it is a risk"? I doubt it's happened yet, but I think the risk is getting worse every year (technology enables this, like when personal identifying information on large numbers of American voters leak from large companies...)

How exactly will you use this PII to perpetuate voter fraud? Show up at a polling station with fake ID or PII? Then at another polling station with another piece of fake ID or PII? What's your plan for voting staff checking the records, and finding out that 'you' already cast a ballot at that station? This kind of fraud is incredibly risky, and does not scale (And is trivial to combat). Election fraud by the process…

Not all states require an ID to vote. Voter ID laws are a controversial measure.

Generally, you register to vote. As long as you input plausible information and a real address you can receive mail at, you are likely to get on the rolls. Once you get on the rolls, you just show up at the polling station and tell them who you are (no ID required), they look for the name in the book, mark you as having voted, and you go vote.

Several years ago they did pass a law federally requiring an ID if you couldn't provide the last-four of an SSN or a driver's license, though, if you're a new voter. Not sure how that works if e.g., you're Amish and don't have an SSN or driver's license.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#22

Post by s73ver_ »

danblick wrote: post #17
s73ver_ wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Show any evidence whatsoever that the type of voter fraud you're talking about is a problem. Until then, the talking point is worthless.

Are you saying, "prove it has happened" or "prove it is a risk"? I doubt it's happened yet, but I think the risk is getting worse every year (technology enables this, like when personal identifying information on large numbers of American voters leak from large companies...)

Both. There has been absolutely no evidence that it is any kind of a risk. Despite all of that information being out there, you still need actual people to go in and do the voting, and in large numbers at that. The amounts of money, and the amounts of people who all have to keep quiet is mindblowing.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#23

Post by rtkwe »

adamw2k wrote: post #8

Lawsuit was filed shortly after SB 442 was passed (which is what allowed the process to begin): http://www.naacp.org/latest/naacp-files-lawsuit-indiana-unla... Sadly, it will have to work its way through the court while names continue to be purged.

Doesn't have to, the NAACP applied for an injunction that would stop the purges while the case is making its way through the court. It's basically the first step any time a law or something like this is challenged in the court.

Couldn't find any follow up articles from a (admittedly super cursory) search saying if it was granted though.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#24

Post by s73ver_ »

Amezarak wrote: post #21
vkou wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How exactly will you use this PII to perpetuate voter fraud? Show up at a polling station with fake ID or PII? Then at another polling station with another piece of fake ID or PII? What's your plan for voting staff checking the records, and finding out that 'you' already cast a ballot at that station? This kind of fraud is incredibly risky, and does not scale (And is trivial to combat). Election fraud by the process…

Not all states require an ID to vote. Voter ID laws are a controversial measure. Generally, you register to vote. As long as you input plausible information and a real address you can receive mail at, you are likely to get on the rolls. Once you get on the rolls, you just show up at the polling station and tell them who you are (no ID required), they look for the name in the book, mark you as having voted, and you go…

And how are you going to do this on a large scale? Especially without being caught?

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#25

Post by JumpCrisscross »

Bud wrote: post #4

This is a crime. The power to unregister voters must be forcibly taken away from states; especially red states, since they are the only ones abusing this power. It should require federal action, instead.

> It should require federal action

Shooting from the hip is a good way to trash a democracy. What you're proposing would allow a single, centralized actor to purge voters from the rolls. De-centralised systems will always have longer, more-idiotic tails. That's the tradeoff for their robust central tendencies.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#26

Post by alistproducer2 »

Anyone with half a brain knows that these purges are designed to advantage a side not protect the system. I read an article the other day that stated that some America's voting system had essentially been compromised on many levels. It made me think about why so many of our polls have, in the last few years, been so off the mark. Now I'm beginning to think it's not because the polling models suddenly don't work. It is quite possibly something more nefarious than that.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#27

Post by Amezarak »

s73ver_ wrote: post #24
Amezarak wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all states require an ID to vote. Voter ID laws are a controversial measure. Generally, you register to vote. As long as you input plausible information and a real address you can receive mail at, you are likely to get on the rolls. Once you get on the rolls, you just show up at the polling station and tell them who you are (no ID required), they look for the name in the book, mark you as having voted, and you go…

And how are you going to do this on a large scale? Especially without being caught?

How would you detect this kind of fraud? Historically, whenever states go about trying to verify their voter registration databases, they end up wiping out swaths of real, actual voters for various reasons, which usually makes it a non-starter.

I doubt it's very common in a fraud sense (though there are probably a lot of people who aren't supposed to be able to vote who end up voting), but either way, it's a difficult problem, probably impossible, to solve without impinging on the rights of the voting public. Voter ID laws disenfranchise people, sharing too much data with the feds has privacy risks, cleaning up the rolls inevitably affects legitimate voters...there's no good way to solve the problem.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#28

Post by travmatt »

awalton wrote: post #18
s73ver_ wrote: post #11

The inaccuracy is a feature, not a bug.

Perhaps more specifically, it's its intended feature, not some goofy side-effect. The whole game here is voter suppression, and this is just one of its many new implementations as heralded under this administration's plan. Can't beat them with Gerrymandering? Deregister people who will vote against you.

If that fails the next step is to launch lawsuits against the voting rights act, and if even that fails then you claim fraud and refuse to recognize the validity of the election, as the Republican Party in Georgia did.

Re: Indiana Purging Voters Using Software That’s 99% Inaccurate

#30

Post by travmatt »

ramy_d wrote: post #19
danblick wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying, "prove it has happened" or "prove it is a risk"? I doubt it's happened yet, but I think the risk is getting worse every year (technology enables this, like when personal identifying information on large numbers of American voters leak from large companies...)

you are spreading FUD which is detracting from a more immediate (and actual) issue

That’s a feature, not a bug.
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