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Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

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Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#21

Post by untog »

ouesp wrote: post #13
inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

IELTS score can evaluate a person's ability in English skills. Canada Express Entry gives points for English skills. While H1B (highly skilled visa) is based on "lottery"

I suspect that the OP is not describing language proficiency. I have met many American-born (and speaking) developers who are still terrible at communicating.

Not that developers are alone in this of course, but it's a profession that allows people to work alone (and often at home/in isolated environments) a lot more than other jobs do.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#22

Post by untog »

dudul wrote: post #14
EduardoBautista wrote: post #6

For TN visas (Canadians and Mexicans only), computer programmers and software _developers_ aren't eligible for visas, but software _engineers_ are. Would this exact situation apply to this new policy?

Serious question, no sarcasm: what is used as a clear and measurable distinction between a software developer and a software engineer?

There is no meaningful one. If the industry can't make the distinction then it's futile to hope that the government will. Having gone through the visa process, it's simply a case of having the right keywords in your work experience (SQL! Check!) - it's quite possible that those checklist items are different between the two jobs, but any enginner/developer will have sufficient overlap that they'd qualify for both.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#23

Post by EduardoBautista »

dudul wrote: post #14
EduardoBautista wrote: post #6

For TN visas (Canadians and Mexicans only), computer programmers and software _developers_ aren't eligible for visas, but software _engineers_ are. Would this exact situation apply to this new policy?

Serious question, no sarcasm: what is used as a clear and measurable distinction between a software developer and a software engineer?

For the TN visa, literally just changing the job title sometimes. Even in Canada for example, Shopify gives you a different job title depending whether or not you have a degree to make it easier to get a Canadian work visa.

In fact, in Canada you need to be a licensed engineer to be a "Software Engineer". Companies get around this by just calling you a "Software Developer".

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#24

Post by Eyas »

vmarsy wrote: post #19
Eyas wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not wrong, but I think slightly talking past the point of the article. I don't know which is right, but my understanding is: Prior to the guidance, H1-B filers could just say "this is a programmer, thus they are a specialist" and now they need to provide evidence (i.e. more effort in filing/submitting impending applications). So while the big H1-B filers might not have had an intention to sneak in an Associate…

>Prior to the guidance, H1-B filers could just say "this is a programmer, thus they are a specialist" and now they need to provide evidence Only at the Nebraska center, not the California one, nor the Vermont one. And it's only a reminder to the Nebraska center that to be considered a specialist you need to hold a bachelor's degree or higher in that field of study. The California and Vermont one were already applying…

Thanks -- this is the explanation I thought was missing from the critique. In that case I agree.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#25

Post by arcticbull »

dudul wrote: post #14
EduardoBautista wrote: post #6

For TN visas (Canadians and Mexicans only), computer programmers and software _developers_ aren't eligible for visas, but software _engineers_ are. Would this exact situation apply to this new policy?

Serious question, no sarcasm: what is used as a clear and measurable distinction between a software developer and a software engineer?

For immigration purposes the distinction centers around the fact that developers 'merely' implement systems and software engineers are expected to design and implement systems. This is based on my experience with the TN status.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#26

Post by EduardoBautista »

arcticbull wrote: post #25
dudul wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question, no sarcasm: what is used as a clear and measurable distinction between a software developer and a software engineer?

For immigration purposes the distinction centers around the fact that developers 'merely' implement systems and software engineers are expected to design and implement systems. This is based on my experience with the TN status.

In this case, there is a lot of visa fraud out there.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#27

Post by bradleyjg »

cldellow wrote: post #8

This calibre of journalism feels like clickbait or, worse, incompetence. > computer programmers are no longer presumed to be eligible for H-1B visas. This is narrowly true based on what the linked document says. But the intent of document seems to be to rescind old guidance that would consider people with associate's degrees, or in some cases, no degrees, experts. That made sense in the 90s when CS was a newer field…

"But the intent of document seems to be to rescind old guidance that would consider people with associate's degrees, or in some cases, no degrees, experts. "

No, it isn't about the people, it's about the occupation. They are saying that entry level computer programming jobs don't constitute a "specialty occupation" because some employers hire people for those jobs without a bachelors degree in the relevant field or equivalent experience. Even if the employee being petitioned for has a bachelors degree in the relevant field or equivalent experience, if the job category, across the industry, doesn't generally require it the offer will not qualify for an H1B.

Re: Changes to USCIS policy on eligibility criteria for H1B visa

#29

Post by inputcoffee »

ouesp wrote: post #13
inputcoffee wrote: post #9

I wish there was a way to distinguish the quality of a worker from the degrees of a worker. Its not just that one wants a "computer technology worker", but one wants an individual who can communicate, work hard when needed, take on responsibility, easily read and comprehend instructions and so on. These are weakly correlated with degrees or how technical a field of study is. An art history undergrad could easily disp…

IELTS score can evaluate a person's ability in English skills. Canada Express Entry gives points for English skills. While H1B (highly skilled visa) is based on "lottery"

When I say communicating, I mean more of a mix of reasoning precisely and explaining clearly rather than English.
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