The Insults of Age • Hacker News Board

Re: The Insults of Age

#21

Post by rustynails77 » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:28 PM UTC

bambax wrote: post #11

RyanMcGreal wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wish more elderly people would decouple their loss of youth from their self regard. I think Garner's point is that we live in a society in which other people's regard for your worth is a function of your age.

The society where "elders" were regarded as wells of wisdom probably never existed. In every society but our own, women after 40 were considered very old. Helen Garner, born Nov. 1942, is 73 years old. She appears to be really full of herself, which is maybe how old people are. She should be happy to be alive instead of complaining about young people being young.

>The society where "elders" were regarded as wells of wisdom probably never existed.

Historically, the Greeks (as one example) respected the opinions of wise elders,

"Monarchies in ancient Greece were not absolute because there was usually a council of older citizens (the senate, or in Macedonia the congress) who gave advice to the King."

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greece

From my own experience, I always sought adults that I felt I could learn from. Even as a kid, I remember thinking some older people gave bad advice and some showed great insight and used this to focus my attention. My own kids seem to echo similar sentiments to my own at the same age.

Re: The Insults of Age

#22

Post by jpmattia » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:32 PM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #16

Older people used to be considered wiser and respected. The baby-boomer generation basically invented ageism when they were young in the 70's, it's ironic to see it bite them back now.

The baby-boomer generation basically invented ageism when they were young in the 70's

Earlier than that. The original "Never trust anyone over 30" was already a saying by the mid-sixties as a consequence of FSM: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Free_Speech_Movement

The movement itself was just another step in the protests of the civil liberties movement, and to some degree HUAC. I'm sure we could go back farther, but that's just off the top of my head.

Essentially, every new generation denigrates the older generation, and each older generation thinks the newer generation is going to hell-in-a-handbasket.

There is nothing new under the sun.

Re: The Insults of Age

#23

Post by y4mi » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:39 PM UTC

doki_pen wrote: post #8

It's interesting that I've had the complete opposite experience as a white man. The older I get the more respect I get in public, for no apparent reason. The painting example was so apt. No one would dare step between me and a painting. It's a very odd thing, as I don't feel like I deserve any more respect than I did 20 years ago.

how old are you, exactly? 40? 50? she is 76, and people definitely start treating you as she describes after ~60. your gender won't matter after that.

and this shouldn't be surprising to anyone. yes, there are a few out there that are able to stay strong even in that age bracket, but they are few.

Re: The Insults of Age

#24

Post by dominotw » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:40 PM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #16

Older people used to be considered wiser and respected. The baby-boomer generation basically invented ageism when they were young in the 70's, it's ironic to see it bite them back now.

> The baby-boomer generation basically invented ageism when they were young in the 70's

I am Not an American. Can you point me to any more info on this.

Re: The Insults of Age

#25

Post by larrymcp » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:43 PM UTC

beachstartup wrote: post #15

onesixtythree wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Age is a weird prejudice because it depends so much on environment. In most companies, you're viewed negatively before age 30: you're expected to work the worst hours because the assumption is that you have nothing "better" to do and would just be out drinking. In Silicon Valley, you're viewed negatively after 30. Some doors close and others open. I do find, strangely, that I'm way more attractive to women now that I…

> although I'm still glad that I married young because I'd imagine that the dating pool shrinks considerably. it actually doesn't, in fact it grows continuously, but you'll just be shamed by older women and married men for dating younger women.

Yep... I didn't take my GF to the office Christmas party, cuz I didn't wanna hear the comments. ay!

Re: The Insults of Age

#26

Post by sandworm101 » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:45 PM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #16

Older people used to be considered wiser and respected. The baby-boomer generation basically invented ageism when they were young in the 70's, it's ironic to see it bite them back now.

> Older people used to be considered wiser and respected.

Then people discovered the internet and learned what the 40s/50s were actually like, what they did, and what we are now saddled with. Those old wise men are now the emperor's new cloths.

Edit: I originally said "those old wise men/women" but lets not kid ourselves. Most all the horrible decisions in those decades were taken by men.

Re: The Insults of Age

#27

Post by rustynails77 » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:50 PM UTC

WalterSear wrote: post #12

epimetheus wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, hypocritically, she negatively judges the youth as such.

Furthermore, she considers a innocent question from a child as a insult to her age and gender.

That's not the half of it. This author deserves no respect based on that article.

She is typical of "me me me" and the continual flow of sexism we see from Australian journalists. The last few decades in Australian media have been a dark spot. This author is sexist, arrogant and takes pride in yanking a strange girl's hair (which is tantamount to assault).

"In two strides I was behind the schoolgirl. I reached up, seized her ponytail at the roots and gave it a sharp downward yank."

"My only regret is that I couldn’t see the Asian woman’s face at the moment the schoolgirl’s head jerked back and her insolent grin turned into a rictus."

Re: The Insults of Age

#28

Post by larrymcp » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 4:51 PM UTC

cafard wrote: post #2

Hmm. It's easier on men, I guess. It does wound my vanity a bit when young women on the bus offer me a seat. But otherwise, being on the large size and generally glum looking, I don't get people baby-talking me or condescending much.

It was funny when the chick at Starbucks called me "sir". Heh.. "sir"... that didn't happen when I was in my early 20's...

Re: The Insults of Age

#29

Post by circlefavshape » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 5:00 PM UTC

doki_pen wrote: post #8

It's interesting that I've had the complete opposite experience as a white man. The older I get the more respect I get in public, for no apparent reason. The painting example was so apt. No one would dare step between me and a painting. It's a very odd thing, as I don't feel like I deserve any more respect than I did 20 years ago.

When my hair went grey I started getting treated with respect instead of contempt by the cool dudes in guitar shops. I don't expect this to persist into my 60s though

Re: The Insults of Age

#30

Post by humanrebar » Thu, Dec 17, 2015, 5:22 PM UTC

rustynails77 wrote: post #27

WalterSear wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Furthermore, she considers a innocent question from a child as a insult to her age and gender.

That's not the half of it. This author deserves no respect based on that article. She is typical of "me me me" and the continual flow of sexism we see from Australian journalists. The last few decades in Australian media have been a dark spot. This author is sexist, arrogant and takes pride in yanking a strange girl's hair (which is tantamount to assault). "In two strides I was behind the schoolgirl. I reached up, se…

Also:

"The armed child behind the police station counter unable to conceal her boredom...."