How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street • Hacker News Board

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#21

Post by deveac » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:31 PM UTC

austenallred wrote: post #10

There is no substance on earth more addictive than Elmo is to a two year old. In most television shows and movies what people are looking for is somebody that represents them - call it an "avatar" if you must. When kids watch Sesame Street they relate directly to Elmo. He's younger, smaller, has an insatiable curiosity, and is in a permanent mode of questioning and discovery. He even has similar mannerisms to childre…

>The reason the author doesn't like Elmo is because he acts like a two year old.

I think the author's reasons for not liking Elmo are actually the ones he stated and took an entire essay to carefully explain.

And I find the author's detailed reasons compelling. I think there's something to be said in modeling behavior that you'd want a younger child to aspire to rather than just presenting them a mirror as they are today. I'm with him in feeling that it just isn't as challenging or valuable. I absolutely think the old show did a much better job of that.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#22

Post by jMyles » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:31 PM UTC

austenallred wrote: post #10

There is no substance on earth more addictive than Elmo is to a two year old. In most television shows and movies what people are looking for is somebody that represents them - call it an "avatar" if you must. When kids watch Sesame Street they relate directly to Elmo. He's younger, smaller, has an insatiable curiosity, and is in a permanent mode of questioning and discovery. He even has similar mannerisms to childre…

I'm not particularly moved by this assessment.

Two year olds are incredibly diverse. Elmo exhibits only certain, particular behaviors of a two-year-old: he is self-centered, demands everyone else's attention, and is mostly oblivious to the fact that he's part of a larger social dynamic.

In the early days of Snuffy and Big Bird, they acted more like two-year-olds also, but they leaned on other qualities that are often evident in people who are learning language and movement: they were thoughtful, unafraid to say things that didn't make sense at first blush, and descriptive about their imaginations.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#23

Post by amyjess » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:32 PM UTC

I'm just old enough to have watched Sesame Street when Grover was a big deal and Elmo had yet to become huge (late '80s), and he was the main character I glommmed onto then. I still don't get Elmo's appeal.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#24

Post by Jtsummers » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:32 PM UTC

LastZactionHero wrote: post #18

DiabloD3 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this. Kotaku articles have no place on the front page of HN, especially ones like this that don't understand the larger context of the program, and its inability to thrive in the "junk food media" environment that is being force fed to kids. If I ever have kids, I'm going to continue to not have TV in my home. They can read all the books I read when I was a kid, or watch select TV shows from the past 20+…

I have the same gut reaction, but as counterpoint, I know some people that grew up with parents that really restricted viewing- not 'no tv at all', but close enough. Later, the parents conceded that the media blackout backfired, as their kid couldn't relate to a lot of the things their peers were talking about- even if it is 'pointless bullshit'. They weren't like a social pariah or anything, but to this day, they fe…

I suspect Hulu+, Netflix, Amazon' and similar will help. With some configuration it should be possible to control what your kids have access to, while still giving them broad access to media their generation is interested in. Compared to the option from 10+ years ago, which was pretty much all TV or no TV and maybe access to a video rental store and theaters for movies.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#25

Post by brandonmenc » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:32 PM UTC

I LOVED Sesame Street, but have always hated Elmo - for exactly the reasons detailed in this article - and I'm glad I'm not the only one.

Fortunately, I'm old enough to have watched Sesame Street before Elmo took over.

As an aside, I wish someone would revive The Electric Company.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#26

Post by fgsfds2015 » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:32 PM UTC

asddubs wrote: post #12

DiabloD3 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this. Kotaku articles have no place on the front page of HN, especially ones like this that don't understand the larger context of the program, and its inability to thrive in the "junk food media" environment that is being force fed to kids. If I ever have kids, I'm going to continue to not have TV in my home. They can read all the books I read when I was a kid, or watch select TV shows from the past 20+…

There's many great modern shows, just like there's a lot of crap from the past. Try watching some steven universe, for example.

I don't think Tumblr: The Show is something you should want to be influencing your kids.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#27

Post by btilly » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:35 PM UTC

asddubs wrote: post #12

DiabloD3 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this. Kotaku articles have no place on the front page of HN, especially ones like this that don't understand the larger context of the program, and its inability to thrive in the "junk food media" environment that is being force fed to kids. If I ever have kids, I'm going to continue to not have TV in my home. They can read all the books I read when I was a kid, or watch select TV shows from the past 20+…

There's many great modern shows, just like there's a lot of crap from the past. Try watching some steven universe, for example.

Yes, there is always a mix, and the mix is always mostly garbage. But if you have a TV in the house, the tendency is just to watch whatever crap is on because it is easy.

Any good current show will eventually become a good old show. And if it is good enough and matches my tastes well enough, I'll eventually hear enough about it that I choose to watch it. And I'm OK with that. I have enough going on in my life that I have no need to rush to watch things just because they are currently being released.

So I believe you when you say that there are great modern shows. And I do not see that as a reason to get a TV.

Disclaimer. I grew up without a TV back when that was really weird. As a grown-up I spent periods both with and without a TV. I have no TV by choice. I do have children, but youtube channels seem to fill the place in their lives that TV serves for most kids.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#28

Post by reuven » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:35 PM UTC

brandonmenc wrote: post #25

I LOVED Sesame Street, but have always hated Elmo - for exactly the reasons detailed in this article - and I'm glad I'm not the only one. Fortunately, I'm old enough to have watched Sesame Street before Elmo took over. As an aside, I wish someone would revive The Electric Company.

They tried. The new Electric Company lasted 1.5 seasons or so. It was totally new and different... and not nearly as addictive, funny, or clever as the original one.

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#29

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:36 PM UTC

DiabloD3 wrote: post #6

webkike wrote: post #2

As with literally every article written by kotaku, oh my god I just don't care

I agree with this. Kotaku articles have no place on the front page of HN, especially ones like this that don't understand the larger context of the program, and its inability to thrive in the "junk food media" environment that is being force fed to kids. If I ever have kids, I'm going to continue to not have TV in my home. They can read all the books I read when I was a kid, or watch select TV shows from the past 20+…

[deleted]

Re: How Elmo Ruined Sesame Street

#30

Post by vinceguidry » Tue, Dec 08, 2015, 7:38 PM UTC

I liked the treatment of Sesame Street as a microcosm of celebrity. Of course the show would find the very first popular chord it hits and then jam on it with all the subtlety of Nickelback. There's way too much money in that, emotional maturity is bound to take a back seat.

I can understand the lamentations, but really, if you were expecting your kids to learn the hard lessons of life from television programs, you deserve all the tantrums you get.