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U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

theatlantic.com

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Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#191

Post by notadoomer236 »

llm_nerd wrote: post #18

This is an insane story demonstrating extraordinary incompetence, not to mention revealing some rather comical beliefs about American exceptionalism. It's on the bottom of the third page, pushed down by flags. During any other administration, such a disastrously , criminally incompetent use of technology would have been top of the front page for days, but this administration is so cosmically incompetent that pointing…

They use signal. They added the wrong person to the chat. Oh well. There’s no real disaster here. No real operational details exposed. Just some politicking that surprises no one.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#192

Post by yubblegum »

jacquesm wrote: post #62
tptacek wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm pretty sure this is actually about shipping lanes and freedom of navigation. Israel doesn't need the help. If you read the story, one of their concerns is that if they don't act, Israel was going to instead.

So no, then it clearly wasn't about shipping lanes and freedom of navigation but just about taking the credit. After all if Israel was going to do it instead it could simply be solved by waiting a little bit. These guys are super transactional and they were afraid they missed the moment that would allow them to take credit and use it as coin for exchange.

Israel tried already if you recall and clearly they couldn't though they certainly tried their hand at shock and awing. The transactional aspect is vis-a-vis Egypt.

https://www.newarab.com/news/israeli-officials-warn-egypts-m...

https://www.jns.org/israel-challenges-egypt-on-secret-sinai-...

Egypt is bleeding money because of loss of transit fees. However, this Muslim Brotherhood wary nation is not keen on the announced ethnic cleansing in Gaza (to Sinai). So this could be inducement to have them host an open air concentration camp with guarantees that navigation through the Suez Canal will resume.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#193

Post by CyberDildonics »

tptacek wrote: post #99
Balgair wrote: post #77

If anything, I'm a bit surprised that Jeff Goldberg burned this source. If anything, I'd suspect that he'd keep the channel open as long as he could. Or, he's got other channels that work better. All the same, I mean, wow. These guys are just morons here, there's really no other way around it. I'm trying to think of a charitable way to spin this and I've got nothing. Like, very clearly, these people are going to get…

As soon as he realizes (or a reasonable person would realize) that the group chat is not a hoax, and that he is getting confidential military information over that channel, his continued membership in the channel demonstrates intent to receive the information, which makes anything he writes about it in the future legally problematic. It's complicated and it's not like just receiving classified information from a sour…

That's the part you're concerned with? Criminal liability of the journalist while the alcoholic was sending government secrets over a signal group chat to unverified members?

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#194

Post by [deleted] »

danso wrote: post #11

Staggering display of incompetence and carelessness. And unfortunately, one that we’re unlikely to get much transparency about, in terms of how such an operational screwup was allowed to happen. > At 11:44 a.m., the account labeled “Pete Hegseth” posted in Signal a “TEAM UPDATE.” I will not quote from this update, or from certain other subsequent texts. The information contained in them, if they had been read by an a…

[deleted]

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#195

Post by xnx »

anigbrowl wrote: post #82
lapcat wrote: post #27

> Waltz set some of the messages in the Signal group to disappear after one week, and some after four. That raises questions about whether the officials may have violated federal records law: Text messages about official acts are considered records that should be preserved. I suspect that this was the point of their using Signal, to avoid preservation of records.

SO much for 'the most transparent administration in history', not that I bought into that claim in the first place. Seems like a violation of multiple public record-keeping laws.

On the other hand, directly sharing war plans with the press is about as transparent as you can get.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#197

Post by ipython »

notadoomer236 wrote: post #191
llm_nerd wrote: post #18

This is an insane story demonstrating extraordinary incompetence, not to mention revealing some rather comical beliefs about American exceptionalism. It's on the bottom of the third page, pushed down by flags. During any other administration, such a disastrously , criminally incompetent use of technology would have been top of the front page for days, but this administration is so cosmically incompetent that pointing…

They use signal. They added the wrong person to the chat. Oh well. There’s no real disaster here. No real operational details exposed. Just some politicking that surprises no one.

Did you read TFA? Operational details were shared on the chat but the journalist, out of concern for exactly what you describe, redacted those details from his report.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#198

Post by ipython »

hello_computer wrote: post #171
outer_web wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I could have swore that was Dick Cheney.

There were many people on the rowing team, but as someone who lived through it, Goldberg was one of its most vigorous members. One expects that there is a special place in hell for all of them.

I mean I lived through it too. So did many others on this site. And my most memorable image is of Colin Powell giving his speech about "yellow cake" to the UN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhWlPo3qxak.

I don't even remember Goldberg or anything he wrote about it, fwiw.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#199

Post by hello_computer »

ipython wrote: post #198
hello_computer wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were many people on the rowing team, but as someone who lived through it, Goldberg was one of its most vigorous members. One expects that there is a special place in hell for all of them.

I mean I lived through it too. So did many others on this site. And my most memorable image is of Colin Powell giving his speech about "yellow cake" to the UN: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhWlPo3qxak . I don't even remember Goldberg or anything he wrote about it, fwiw.

You must've not sat with the old people watching the talking heads all day. Goldberg was ubiquitous. Per the wiki:

Glenn Greenwald called Goldberg "one of the leading media cheerleaders for the attack on Iraq," saying Goldberg had "compiled a record of humiliating falsehood-dissemination in the run-up to the war that rivaled Judy Miller's both in terms of recklessness and destructive impact".

Greenwald's assessment harmonizes with personal experience.

Re: U.S. national-security leaders included me in a group chat

#200

Post by Jtsummers »

e44858 wrote: post #180
legitster wrote: post #15

The whole thread is WILD, and the fact that it was verified is crazy. But the actual text of the thread is horrifying: On one hand, they say they complain about "bailing out Europe". But on the other hand, they explicitly moved up the timeline so they could move before other actors and take credit. > "If the US successfully restores freedom of navigation at great cost there needs to be some further economic gain extr…

How was it verified?

It's been acknowledged by the government that this happened. They aren't denying anything, and are saying it was just a mistake. From WSJ:

> House Speaker Mike Johnson (R., La.) dismissed questions about whether Waltz should face consequences for discussing the Yemen operation on an unclassified chat group that included a journalist. “Clearly I think the administration has acknowledged it was a mistake and they’ll tighten up and make sure it doesn’t happen again.”

https://www.wsj.com/politics/national-security/trump-us-war-...

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