I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything • Hacker News Board

Re: I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything

#191

Post by ArtixFox » Thu, Jul 18, 2024, 11:07 AM UTC

Ygg2 wrote: post #17

WhereIsTheTruth wrote: post #4

Projects adopting rust makes contributing less fun and more painful I tried to work on bug fix for Zed, waiting 30 seconds everytime you change a value was _very_ painful

What were you waiting on? You shouldn't have run cargo build every change. And cargo check shouldn't take that long.

cargo check will take long once you use macros. And now the advice changes to "well you shouldnt use that many macros", and a new criticism will be made, followed by "well you shouldnt....." and a new...

I dont think this wont even work for most kind of programming. I always do an edit-compile-run cycle when im programming, or I break everything to .so and dynamically reload as much as possible. Very easy with C++ and C.

I am waiting on zig and its in place binary patching. But just saying that you should cargo check instead of running and seeing with your eyes if your change made sense or not or is affecting perf or not is....ridiculous.

I think this kind of development flow works better when you are writing already solved solutions or rewriting code. How on earth are you gonna cargo check a perf issue, or a game or memory leaks???

Re: I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything

#192

Post by ArtixFox » Thu, Jul 18, 2024, 12:58 PM UTC

WhereIsTheTruth wrote: post #190

WhereIsTheTruth wrote: post #4

Projects adopting rust makes contributing less fun and more painful I tried to work on bug fix for Zed, waiting 30 seconds everytime you change a value was _very_ painful

The fact that i got downvoted says it all, people are in delusional mode Zig devs are tackling the issue early, Rust devs are living with it, it's just sad

adding to this, People that say cargo check is the answer dont even understand the problem at hand.

Just because the language is compiled does not mean it needs to take 30 business days to compile something.

You can have fast compile times and good performance too. SBCL the common lisp implementation is extremely famous in these circles for its performance. IT IS A BATCH COMPILED LANGUAGE WITH A REPL!!

You cannot use cargo check for perf issues, for memory leaks, for trying to solve a problem that does not have a solution...etc etc.

Even then cargo check will make you bleed if you use macros.

Re: I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything

#193

Post by pklausler » Thu, Jul 18, 2024, 3:13 PM UTC

aragilar wrote: post #189

pklausler wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What new scientific applications are being written in Fortran?

Fluid dynamics codes are still being written in Fortran. Notably, there are still improvements happening in the Fortran space, and there's been a bit of revival of sorts. There are still features in Fortran that make it nicer to write in than C++ (and while I'd hoped rust might be a good Fortran replacement, I feel rust has taken a different path, and remains no better than C++).

New CFD codes? Links?

Re: I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything

#194

Post by anonymoushn » Fri, Jul 19, 2024, 8:15 AM UTC

weinzierl wrote: post #180

anonymoushn wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I feel a lot of this async criticism has more to do with how async is used than with Rust itself. Maybe it would be good to have more crates that don't used async or even depend on tokio, but in the end this is on us as a community. No, this is a language design issue. In Lua or Zig the easy way to write a library that speaks websockets produces a library that works with synchronous or asynchronous i/o and with the…

This is being worked on: https://blog.rust-lang.org/inside-rust/2022/07/27/keyword-ge...

This looks great! The example in the linked post directly addresses the obvious follow-up of "well, what about for functions that use traits that are currently divided into two or more flavors?". I hope it progresses to an RFC and code sometime!

Re: I Hope Rust Does Not Oxidize Everything

#195

Post by prmph » Sun, Jul 21, 2024, 12:09 PM UTC

Rust is a systems programming language. It forces you to think about computer architecture as you are writing code. The language is a tool expressing how logic should execute safely and performantly on actual hardware. That is both its strength and weakness.

I agree with the article in so far as the hope that people will not start pushing Rust as the cool language for pretty much everything.

For many development endeavors, the language is a tool purely for expressing logic, and for that Rust is a poor choice IMO.