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Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

theguardian.com

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Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#191

Post by gcheong »

mcpackieh wrote: post #176
gcheong wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sex is normal - making rape lists and sexual harassment/abuse is not. There’s quite a bit of consensual middle-ground between “sexless Victorian vulcans” and outright sexual harassment/abuse and the latter shouldn’t be tolerated regardless of who it is.

The suggestion I responded to was that humans turn off their "lizard brain" and to stop thinking about their coworkers in any sort of sexual way. Obviously making "rape lists" is very far over the line and should not be tolerated (who said otherwise?!) but to ban people from even thinking about their coworkers in a sexual way is patently absurd. We're humans, you would have to chemically neuter people to accomplish t…

Fair enough. I agree turning off the lizard brain is impossible so if I misread your comment in this way I apologize. I was more referring to "people are going to have sex when working together, even when just men", which I agree with, but wanted to make the distinction between co-workers hooking up to what was referred to in the article, which wasn't clear to me from your comment.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#192

Post by mulmen »

waffleiron wrote: post #172
tpmx wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bi lateral, you say? SIPRI (Stockholm International Peace Research Institute): Countries with an increase in stockpiled nuclear warheads from Jan 2022 to Jan 2023: China: +60 Russia: +12 Pakistan: +5 North Korea: +5 India: +4 https://www.statista.com/chart/30173/the-countries-expanding...

This would be a more interesting statistic with the full stockpile amount. Now it seems misleading, as if the US and Russia don’t have vastly more nukes than the others.

With MAD does it matter? Isn’t the idea that if anyone launches nukes everyone launches nukes?

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#193

Post by mcpackieh »

Floegipoky wrote: post #184
mcpackieh wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He doesn't care, and neither do I. It is whether comments are raised to HR, management, or for personal lawsuits. This is potentially career ending Obviously his first priority is his own career. How can you expect it to be any other way? Get real.

Engaging in gender discrimination is probably not the best way to avoid accusations of gender discrimination affecting one's career.

Going for drinks after work with your male colleagues, but not the women, is most likely a net positive for your career. Very rarely is anybody fired for such an offense as not hanging out with women after work, but building a closer relationship with the other men you work with will pay dividends.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#194

Post by notahacker »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #153
defrost wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tarred and feathered? Not in England. Eton (1440-), Harrow (1572), Radley (1847) are all prestige "public" (for very rich well connected 'public') boys-only schools; the jewels in a crown of many more [1] that serve as introductions to a sea of men only clubs that still exist aplenty. With examples of an exclusive to women apartment building, many exclusive to male schools and clubs the only thing demonstrating gende…

It seems significant that your allowed "male only spaces" are only for rich elite; whilst the objection was against lauding the provision of housing that excludes men (given the number of men without accommodation far exceeds the number of women in that situation). How does the uber-elite having men-only spaces make it OK to exclude men from housing opportunities. This often seems the case to me, the ruling classes (…

The female only senior citizen housing project disingenuously linked to homelessness is also for wealthy elites.

Nobody with the slightest bit of understanding honestly believes that there is a single man without access to accommodation that would be able to move off the streets if only a owner-occupied new build development in New Barnet was open to men purchasing a flat there.

On the other hand, there are a large number of hostel beds (much larger than the New Barnet project celebrated for its uniqueness) potentially accessible to London's homeless which are reserved specifically for men

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#195

Post by vkou »

mulmen wrote: post #192
waffleiron wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be a more interesting statistic with the full stockpile amount. Now it seems misleading, as if the US and Russia don’t have vastly more nukes than the others.

With MAD does it matter? Isn’t the idea that if anyone launches nukes everyone launches nukes?

There's MAD and there's MAD. Nobody is going to invade NK, because even a few nukes make it a horrible idea, but I also don't consider NK launching it's weapons to be a fundamental, serious threat to global civilization.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#196

Post by throwway120385 »

dylan604 wrote: post #89
stevenwoo wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me, too, the bonus must be just enough for them to fill the ranks. They must send that brochure to every graduating electrical engineer. One of my uncles did that in the 1970-80s and ended up working at a nuclear power plant for the rest of his civilian career. It's a living, though the number/location of civilian jobs in the USA probably is not great.

That was what I was being sold. Do 20 years in the service, then retire with a pension at the age of 38. Do another 20 years in a civilian role, then retire with a second pension before turning 60. I didn't buy it.

To be fair all the guys retiring at 58 were finished doing exactly that.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#197

Post by ricktdotorg »

OldGuyInTheClub wrote: post #45

The BBC did a documentary in the 1980s on the submarine commander selection process. It is called "The Perisher" with good reason. I can only find Part 1 on YT but have definitely seen the whole thing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1LF2I3fTbY

looks like there is a newer version (more recent) following potential sub commanders for the royal navy called "Submarine School". 4 parts, all are on YT. there is even a US navy submariner among the potential captains!

part 1: > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dZBNFFaDkY

Search for "Submarine School Episode of4" for the rest.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#198

Post by callalex »

darkclouds wrote: post #109
callalex wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sharing this fascinating take on how you experience the world. Personally, as a man, I have never found the need to worry about any of the issues you highlight when interacting with other genders. I wonder what makes our experiences so different?

I've been accused of groping a woman at staff party when I hadnt. Other colleagues knew my married male manager was having an affair with this single mum and was at it in a room with all the coats. I was asked to go get a coat by a colleague that knew what was going on and I walked in on them so walked straight back out. Monday morning to save face, she accused me of groping her and spread it around the company. I le…

Do you habitually generalize the behavior of one lying person to a entire half of the human population?

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#199

Post by Gareth321 »

Floegipoky wrote: post #170
Gareth321 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a male, I can assure you that the types of comments that you think “pass without thought” isn't considered desirable by all of your fellow male colleagues either. Sure they won't necessarily complaint about it publicly, but they'll still see you in a negative way. You seem to have missed his point. It isn't whether his comments are considered desirable. He doesn't care, and neither do I. It is whether comments a…

* "I am very careful never to be alone in a room with a woman" * "I don't 'banter' with women because I am worried that one of my comments, however harmless in intent, will be perceived poorly" Don't you think these behaviors are negatively impacting the careers of these women?

Maybe, but I don't see why that's my problem. Society has created a system by which my risk increases exponentially when I engage in friendly conversation with women. The rational response is to reduce exposure to that risk.

Re: Life on board a British nuclear submarine (2012)

#200

Post by waffleiron »

mulmen wrote: post #192
waffleiron wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be a more interesting statistic with the full stockpile amount. Now it seems misleading, as if the US and Russia don’t have vastly more nukes than the others.

With MAD does it matter? Isn’t the idea that if anyone launches nukes everyone launches nukes?

We don't truly have MAD with someone who has a small amount of nuclear weapons. Specifically one of the reasons the US dropped out of the ABM treaty was because they argued that they should be able to defend against countries with a small amount of nuclear weapons.

It's also unlikely that everyone else launches their nukes during MAD, it's a doctrine that specifically applies to an attacker and a defender.

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