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Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

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Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#191

Post by spaceman_2020 »

lottin wrote: post #184
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crypto has been around for decades but most of the tech we now call "Web3" is very nascent. The ERC-721 standard used by most NFTs was first proposed in 2018, and didn't even reach technical maturity until 2019. And yes, you can write normal contracts and get the courts to enforce it. But what if your customers are in India or Vietnam or Tibet? Under which jurisdiction will you attempt to enforce the contract? The en…

A so-called 'smart contract' is not a replacement for a contract. Just because you call something a contract doesn't mean it is. The same applies to 'decentralised finance'. It's not finance unless it can do financing, and defi can't.

my dude, do you always evaluate things for what they are rather than what they could be?

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#192

Post by lottin »

linuxdude314 wrote: post #114
angry_moose wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Paraphrasing this week's TWiT: Web 1.0 and 2.0 were created by engineers to solve problems. Web 3/3.0 was invented by finance bros to disguise their various scams as the next technology revolution.

That’s cynical at best. One of the goals of Web3 is to enable direct commerce without trusted intermediaries. Anyone here like using PayPal? What if instead you had the equivalent of cash that you could use on the internet? Web3 is attempting to create an economy decoupled from existing currencies (fiat). Unlike a country seigniorage determined ahead of time, and is publicly visible for all to see. If the idea of cre…

Can you explain what you mean by direct commerce without intermediaries? Do you consider the retailer an intermediary? The shipping company?

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#193

Post by larsonnn »

edgyquant wrote: post #32
ugjka wrote: post #3

I seriously do not see and never saw how "Web 3.0" is a follow up from web 1 and 2. The whole thing was a hijack by ponzi schemers or just another way to get someone to get their life savings into some crypto nonsense.

Web3 as decentralized services is the logical next step. Ethereum stealing the name and doing everything they can to be associated with it is a load of bs taking away the glamor from real decentralized services that I assure you are coming

What is the meaning of decentralized services ?

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#194

Post by zenen »

nemo44x wrote: post #64
zenen wrote: post #28

Dang, this sucks. Not the post, I respect & understand the opinion. It sucks that the initiative of creating a deflationary currency started this massive wave of people thinking that they're smarter than whoever invented Bitcoin in the first place. Everybody bought in to the hype but nobody wants to invest the time into understanding how the actual technology works. "In fact the entire Blockchain arena is filled with…

> capitalism is in its late stages and government bailouts won't keep it floating forever. It's funny to see this critique pop up in various places completely unaware of the fact that capitalism has more or less been dead since the 1940s. The Great Depression was the end of them as a dominating cultural force and they've been replaced by a managed-everything; a management class. So when you speak of capitalism only e…

yea, that's fair. I know that money hasn't been real since we got off the gold standard, I'm just hella socialist and take any chance I can get to take pot shots at the state of today's economy to further my narrative.

Free market economy is the only way I see us cooperating on a global scale though, its hard to imagine otherwise - that's why I support Bitcoin

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#195

Post by edgyquant »

larsonnn wrote: post #193
edgyquant wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Web3 as decentralized services is the logical next step. Ethereum stealing the name and doing everything they can to be associated with it is a load of bs taking away the glamor from real decentralized services that I assure you are coming

What is the meaning of decentralized services ?

This is not a good faith question, Google it

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#196

Post by lottin »

k__ wrote: post #17
roody15 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly… NFT’s blah blah .. blockchain everything .. came off as like a sales pitch and never seemed to resonant as where the web was headed

Web2: you stop paying a cloud provider, your data is gone. Web3: you stop paying a network, your data stays online. Either because it's permanent by default (blockchain, blockweave) or because people deem it interesting and pin it (IPFS) Seems like a fundamental improvement to me.

A fundamental improvement in terms of what? The cloud provider provides a service conditional on being paid, whereas what you call "the network" seems to provide the service for free. Who's paying for the service?

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#197

Post by larsonnn »

peoplefromibiza wrote: post #70
nailer wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With a zero balance, identity. Identity is simply connecting to a wallet and reading a signed DID - the wallet could have zero balance and it still works. Boom you just signed into something without Google / Facebook / Apple. With close to a zero balance (but not quite zero) to pay transaction fees, you can do peer to peer encrypted messaging without central arbiters. With close to a zero balance (but not quite zero)…

wallets are a crtptocurrency concept. you can do the same thing with a client certificate, boom, you are who the cert says you are.

This.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#198

Post by pwinnski »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #136

So many short-sighted critiques. Web3 or whatever might not be the answer, but you have to ask yourself a question: what's the internet going to look like in 2030, when the majority of its traffic is non-western, and a massive share of all purchasing power resides in Africa and Asia? Do you think by 2030, all global governments and their citizens will voluntarily give away control over what they can consume and creat…

> Do you think by 2030, all global governments and their citizens will voluntarily give away control over what they can consume and create to Google and Apple?

It'll be Baidu and Tencent, but yes. This is already happening, and the internet is becoming more centralized, not less. Global traffic is balkanized, but it's split up among regional centralized controlling interesting, not no controlling interests.

> Betting in favor of the current centralized western oligopolies is betting on the belief that the digital economy won't grow, and that there won't be a regulatory crackdown in countries with stronger technological capabilities.

This is a false dichotomy. One need not bet for or against "current centralized western oligopolies" to bet against crypto fever dreams. One could assume that western oligopolies will be supplanted by eastern oligopolies, for example, or that the two will divvy up the market and coexist.

I would definitely bet in favor of large countries having separate social networks, because that's what we have now.

You seem to have a very western focus, and little to no understanding of how things are working in, say, China. Perhaps that's where you've gone wrong.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#199

Post by larsonnn »

TekMol wrote: post #19

Web3 is already making inroads piece by piece into the web. It started with ssh. Once keys were exchanged, you did not have to trust the infrastructure providers anymore. You knew whom you are talking to and that the communication is not tampered with. Similar with https. A recent development is that ActivityPub profiles have private keys and publish their public keys. So if you run your own Fediverse node, you alrea…

So connecting with TLS should be fine then.

Re: Web3 – An Arrogant and Treacherous Successor Doomed to Fail

#200

Post by pwinnski »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #174
RC_ITR wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s always so interesting to me that we already saw this happen - look no further than China - and they became oligapolized even more than the west. Centralization works. You may not like it and you hope that developing world won’t either, but WhatsApps success sort of invalidates all your points. Countries are fine handing over nearly all their data to whatever platform works best, because who wants less than the b…

It's not a problem yet because for much of the developing world, large scale internet adoption is a very recent phenomenon. And the leadership in most of these countries is still non tech savvy. There has simply not been enough time for the people or their leadership/bureaucracies to figure out what the long-term impact of this technoloy will be. India, for instance, had 250M internet users in 2015. That number is no…

We've seen countries moving online for may years now, and the move up the scale in economic prosperity always seems to be more of a factor than the actual technical savvy. Haiti could build an App Store, but they'd have trouble attracting developers for the fractional pennies they could charge for apps.

The government of my garden shed has announced plans to create its own mobile App Store, too, but so far uptake has been minimal. The move toward viable alternatives takes time, and the seven years you've allocated doesn't seem like nearly enough. 2030 is as far from now as we are from 2015, and things haven't changed nearly as much in the last seven years as you seem to be predicting they will in the next seven years. Past performance is no guarantee of future results... but they're an indicator.

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