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Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

kite.com

191–200 of 547 posts

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Devs almost always lack any kind of purchase authority. Any tool that appeals to devs needs to appeal to their management more, either showing some kind of cost savings over existing tools, increased dev productivity, or the new fangled "dev experience" where this tool, by shear awesomeness, will let devs put aside the low salary, process hell, and keep them employed.

I understand that's Kite's perspective (and yours -- "purchasing won't pay for this"), but devs are not paid meager salaries in general, and definitely might care about their code quality when it's put out in 'public' whether that be internal repos, or github. Payscale estimates average engineering salary as having between $3,000 and $7,000 a month more in disposable income over writers -- and I would guess almost ev…

> I understand that's Kite's perspective (and yours -- "purchasing won't pay for this"), but devs are not paid meager salaries in general

Perhaps an under-appreciated perspective – most of us don't come from families that were paid the sort of salaries we get; and consequently we are more likely to be irrationally stingy about money as a result of having grown up (relatively) poor. I know that $200/year is not a significant cost at my salary; but I do remember a time when that would have been totally out of reach for me.

And also there's the fairness aspect – do I want to be participating in a system where only rich devs can get access to good tools? Yes, I understand that the world is not fair and already works that way, but I should probably not perpetuate that system; and instead, make work pay for it.

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#192

I'm confused. "we were 10+ years too early to market, i.e. the tech is not ready yet." "Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools." "We built the most-advanced AI for helping developers, but it fell short of the 10× improvement required to break through because today’s state of the art for ML on code is not good enough." Sounds like you know why people didn't pay for it. If it truly did make pe…

Sounds to me like blaming everybody other than themselves. However major props for open sourcing it when the company failed.

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What shady stuff they did?

> developers began noticing something: Kite had quietly injected promotional content and data-tracking functionality into open-source apps the company previously had no affiliation with. The discoveries of those injections, and Kite’s initial refusal to roll them back, led to backlash from programmers who felt the company’s actions undermined the open-source community. https://qz.com/1043614/this-startup-learned-the-…

I was looking for such comment to understand why the GoodByeAds (which I use with NextDNS) contains a record for kite.com (which means I'll have to add an exception to access kite.com).

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#194
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Loads of devs I’ve spoken to, from junior to principal level, absolutely love Github Copilot though. Don’t know who is paying it for them, nor if Kite was significantly worse, but I think that at least Copilot has a brilliant future ahead of it.

It's interesting, the ones I've spoken to are extremely suspicious. "GitHub Copilot blocks your ability to learn." Is a common refrain. I don't see ANY industry-wide consensus on whether GitHub Copilot truly helps developers right now. The only scenario I can get anyone to agree on is generating templates. Aka, JSON or CSS files that you then edit.

> "GitHub Copilot blocks your ability to learn." Is a common refrain.

On the contrary, it frequently suggests code that adhere to better practices.

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#195
post #18

"Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools. Their manager might, but engineering managers only want to pay for discrete new capabilities, i.e. making their developers 18% faster when writing code did not resonate strongly enough." I never used Kite, but I've tried Github Copilot twice, and found it marginal at best (and distracting at worst - which is why I turned it off both times). If Kite wa…

Loads of devs I’ve spoken to, from junior to principal level, absolutely love Github Copilot though. Don’t know who is paying it for them, nor if Kite was significantly worse, but I think that at least Copilot has a brilliant future ahead of it.

Copilot is extremely shady, and everyone should refrain from paying for it until proven otherwise.

Others have already pointed out the case as a reply.

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#196
I tried Tabnine and had mixed feelings. It can make sensible suggestions and save my time, but Tabnine forcing said suggestions to top priority means I’m spending time to press down key to find the obvious autocomplete. And this can’t be turned off.

Not sure about Kite though

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#198
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Loads of devs I’ve spoken to, from junior to principal level, absolutely love Github Copilot though. Don’t know who is paying it for them, nor if Kite was significantly worse, but I think that at least Copilot has a brilliant future ahead of it.

It's interesting, the ones I've spoken to are extremely suspicious. "GitHub Copilot blocks your ability to learn." Is a common refrain. I don't see ANY industry-wide consensus on whether GitHub Copilot truly helps developers right now. The only scenario I can get anyone to agree on is generating templates. Aka, JSON or CSS files that you then edit.

A coworker of mine uses it, it almost seems like an unfair advantage but I can also use it too if I want to. Specifically writing hard to decipher code eg. functional composition but Copilot will spit it out.

I haven't wanted to use it personally. I'm also not a senior dev or anything so my opinion is not worth much.

Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code

#200
post #44
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I pay for github co-pilot. It seems surprisingly bad for typescript and excellent for python.

I tried it. Ironically, it was pretty good for Powershell and so so for Python (in my case at least).

Yeah, where it seems very good for me is just writing flask or fast api boilerplate, esp if I have a good function sig + doc string.

I kind of hoped that it would propose good tsx for my components (react+mui) but instead it’s basically useless. Maybe problem is that I chose “filter out exact code reproductions.”

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