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I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

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Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#191

Post by smoldesu »

zac23or wrote: post #185
kobalsky wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand that your point is about Linux zealots, but this isn't correct: > linux doesn't support the motherboard wifi chip Some drivers are included with the kernel and have 1st class support due to their importance but most wireless and video depends on manufacturers due to changing hardware and licencing issues. You are a software developer, you know this should read "the manufacturer didn't release a Linux dri…

Regardless of why the driver doesn't exist, the result is the same: Linux does not support the motherboard Wifi chip. Probably many Linux problems are not just technical problems, but political problems or other types of problems, but the result is the same: A terrible user experience.

> Linux does not support the motherboard Wifi chip.

I'm sorry, this is a bald-faced lie. Every motherboard I've ever purchased has worked just fine with Linux networking out-of-the-box. If you bought a motherboard that doesn't support Linux, then I'm sorry to hear. That doesn't apply to everything though, so I'd recommend revising your wording in the future.

It's kinda like complaining that your new Nvidia GPU won't get recognized by your Mac Pro, therefore all GPUs are incompatible with MacOS!

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#192

Post by zac23or »

pessimizer wrote: post #179
zac23or wrote: post #141

It's a "Solid Debian Tablet" because it boots. Linux religionists ignore all problems after booting. Linux and Oss in general are religions like Apple is. "Apple has NEVER done anything wrong," an Apple cleric told me about Antennagate. I've been using Linux for programming work for ten years now, but every time I buy a new machine I try to use Linux natively. In the last attempt, Linux stopped working after I tried…

I'd say your experience is atypical. When I'm preparing to buy a new device that I expect to install Linux on, I look it up and make sure that everything will work (or the steps to take to ensure everything will work.) I buy the device, install Linux on first power-up, it installs fine, I never have any significant problems that I wasn't expecting. Instead of constantly accusing people of being religious zealots (in…

> When I'm preparing to buy a new device that I expect to install Linux on, I look it up and make sure that everything will work

My friend did the same thing and in the end the Wifi didn't work.

> Instead of constantly accusing people of being religious zealots

Many people are religious about one thing or another, Linux is no exception, it's a fact of life.

> how about just doing an hour of research before making your next attempt?

Needing to research whether the hardware supports Linux is a clear indication that it shouldn't be used! Linux has been around for 30 years! if in 30 years the project has not solved the problem of drivers, it is a shame and a total failure in this area, because billions are invested in Linux per year.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#193

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

highwaylights wrote: post #46

It doesn’t sound solid reading the author’s post. - EFI didn’t work. - The camera doesn’t work. - The SSD is too small so needed to be topped up with a MicroSD (awful). - Not lap-friendly for travelling (type cover). - Windows 11 needed to be kept around despite not being used (and sometimes rewrote the boot menu, if I’m reading this correctly). This sounds like a downright painful experience. I’m not sure why you’d…

Agreed, this is why I find Chromebook, with its great Linux container support, so nice. I know the author mentioned he tried this on a Lenovo Chromebook and said it was dog slow. I have it running on my Pixelbook and with maxed out RAM it worked well.

Soooooo sad there hasn't been much news on a new Pixelbook, was such a great device.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#194

Post by zac23or »

smoldesu wrote: post #191
zac23or wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regardless of why the driver doesn't exist, the result is the same: Linux does not support the motherboard Wifi chip. Probably many Linux problems are not just technical problems, but political problems or other types of problems, but the result is the same: A terrible user experience.

> Linux does not support the motherboard Wifi chip. I'm sorry, this is a bald-faced lie. Every motherboard I've ever purchased has worked just fine with Linux networking out-of-the-box. If you bought a motherboard that doesn't support Linux, then I'm sorry to hear. That doesn't apply to everything though, so I'd recommend revising your wording in the future. It's kinda like complaining that your new Nvidia GPU won't…

> This is a bald-faced lie

I another thing people say: You're a liar.

> That doesn't apply to everything

I never said that. And I never said that every GPU is incompatible with Linux.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#195

Post by 31835843 »

highwaylights wrote: post #46

It doesn’t sound solid reading the author’s post. - EFI didn’t work. - The camera doesn’t work. - The SSD is too small so needed to be topped up with a MicroSD (awful). - Not lap-friendly for travelling (type cover). - Windows 11 needed to be kept around despite not being used (and sometimes rewrote the boot menu, if I’m reading this correctly). This sounds like a downright painful experience. I’m not sure why you’d…

This is my experience with every “Linux works on…” post. It’s always caveated down to an unreasonable definition of working.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#196

Post by zac23or »

smoldesu wrote: post #190
zac23or wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ings Microsoft made sure with their business tactics regarding Windows: that Windows should be the primary PC platform...and with ruthless business deals Yes, without doubt, Microsoft make a lot of bad things to Windows being the primary pc platform. > That said, I lucked out with my Linux experience. Everything I need works well My friend who uses a USB dongle for Wifi says the same thing!

> My friend who uses a USB dongle for Wifi says the same thing! I reckon you may have not tried a recent Linux kernel. Network hardware support is definitely better than MacOS at this point, and is creeping up on Windows in the consumer segment. I've used 5 different devices from 5 different manufacturers on Linux. Only one of them had a WiFi issue, which was only because the distro I was testing didn't ship with the…

I tried it this year, with the gaming laptop I use for programming. After Bluetooth problem, I didn't try again.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#197

Post by least »

rovr138 wrote: post #162
rollcat wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is better served by a laptop for the majority of people, though as someone that uses an unconventional keyboard anyway, a laptop is somewhat less compelling (since it occupies a lot of space with a keyboard that I actively avoid using), I can certainly see the appeal of a tablet for that purpose. I've switched to an Ergodox in early 2019 and I couldn't use a laptop since. MNT[1] is the only laptop manufacturer…

I've been using a Advantage Pro for over 10 years now and it's great. But I still travel and use my MBP's and now my Surface Pro's keyboard. Besides shortcuts between Windows and Mac, I can type on any of them. Of course, I prefer my Kinesis, but, it's not an issue really switching.

I don't have trouble typing but I do have trouble trying to type for a long period of time on a standard laptop keyboard because it tends to cause flare ups in my hands, the whole reason I switched to an ergonomic keyboard (in my case a Kinesis Advantage 2).

I do wish there was a better option available on keyboards but alas the market is quite niche. Separating the keyboard from the laptop seems to be the only realistic option for people with those needs.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#198

Post by jancsika »

zac23or wrote: post #141

It's a "Solid Debian Tablet" because it boots. Linux religionists ignore all problems after booting. Linux and Oss in general are religions like Apple is. "Apple has NEVER done anything wrong," an Apple cleric told me about Antennagate. I've been using Linux for programming work for ten years now, but every time I buy a new machine I try to use Linux natively. In the last attempt, Linux stopped working after I tried…

> In ten years I never got hardware that runs 100% on Linux.

You've never used XPS 13 Developer's Edition. It ships with Ubuntu. The hardware runs 100% on Linux.

I even checked with the intel GPU command that measures whether it's actually using accelerated video. Everything works on Firefox and Chromium. Well, except those Reddit videos that use the web blob API, but those seem to buffer and screw up on every OS I've ever used.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#199

Post by w4rh4wk5 »

Macha wrote: post #157
w4rh4wk5 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never used the Kindle app, so I don't know what that user experience is like, but I've been pretty happy with Sumatra PDF for reading EPUBs. Inside the advanced settings you can adjust color, font, and font size. For me, that's all I need from an ebook reader.

Does Sumatra support reading Amazon's books direct, or do you need to pass them through DeDRM first? Or is there some other store selling DRM-free epubs I'm not aware of? I end up stripping DRM off mine with Calibre's tools, then reading them on calibre-web.

Pretty sure Amazon's books are not directly supported.

Re: I Finally Found a Solid Debian Tablet: The Surface Go 2

#200

Post by least »

sseagull wrote: post #33
least wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is better served by a laptop for the majority of people, though as someone that uses an unconventional keyboard anyway, a laptop is somewhat less compelling (since it occupies a lot of space with a keyboard that I actively avoid using), I can certainly see the appeal of a tablet for that purpose. I personally don't think Microsoft quite got it right with using Windows on a tablet, though it was certainly a lot b…

I bought a Surface 7+ a few months ago and really like it. I think of it as a “laptop replacement”. My serious work is done on a desktop with 3 large monitors at home, and a laptop with two large monitors at work. So I only needed a small-ish laptop to handle the in-between. Plus I can read books or watch videos, take notes, etc, in tablet mode. > building apps that fit the UX paradigms of Surface tablets I kinda don…

I think the Surface line serves the "I only want one portable device" crowd well enough, even though I think it could be better. Applications being able to adapt based on the way you're interfacing with them would be the most work required from developers but also probably the best of both worlds... just that'd require Microsoft investing in 3rd party developer support in a way they haven't before.

I personally use both a laptop and an iPad regularly enough in their own contexts that I find it worthwhile to have both.

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