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PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

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Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#191
post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, account numbers are not a significant 'secret' or something like that. They are just as 'safe' to share as phone numbers.

Think about it this way: a check is just an account number on some fancy paper, with a few more numbers.

Technically speaking you can write a check on anything. One company paid their tax with one written on a 150lb halibut.

https://mobile.twitter.com/barclays/status/77386310895160115...

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I occasionally had disagreements with shop owners because I didn't have cash and I wanted them to add the payment fee manually so I could pay by card and actually - you know - buy stuff. A lot simply wouldn't - like I was attempting fraud or something.

I once tried to buy a beer in a small corner shop. The beer was 2€. The minimum charge for card payments was 5€. I agreed to pay 5€. The shopkeeper refused to charge me 5€. I walked out without my beer, sad, and wishing I'd remembered to carry some cash that day.

Couldn't you buy three? I mean, if you're already price insensitive to pay 5 euro for one...

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, account numbers are not a significant 'secret' or something like that. They are just as 'safe' to share as phone numbers.

For anyone in the US, if I have your bank account number, I can steal your money. I strongly advise you not to share your account number with me or anyone else. I have to commit fraud in order to steal your money, making it a crime, but stealing's a crime in the first place, so that's not going to deter thieves.

Jeremy Clarkson fell victim to this. He published his bank details in his column to prove it was no big deal, and someone set up a £500 direct debit to charity.

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#194
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that high fees aren't a prerequisite for consumer protection. European credit cards offer full protection, despite having capped interchange fees.

Do they? Can I get an immediate refund for anything if I don’t like the item? I can with my Amex. No questions asked under $1000.

How many places globally are going to accept the Amex? If you are in Europe somewhere, are you going to be able to use it to buy groceries?

Probably not, and almost definitely not at the small retailer. Amex charges are more for the retailer, so they often simply don't accept it.

Other than that, though: I'm not sure how often you even need that $1000 'no questions asked' policy. Second, return policies through the EU market (plus at least one country) are pretty good without credit card protections. It just really isn't a big concern. Finally, the culture around returning goods differs in different areas. Folks here (Norway) seem way less disposed to returning items - especially for simply not liking an item and would rather do some research upfront. (Not working as desired, defective, and things like that are a bit different, but folks still hesitate).

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#195
post #5

Still the easiest way to start selling online, at least in Europe... They've got the low volume starter business niche by the balls.

We're an online retailer and they wanted to keep all payments for 60 days from us. Stripe pay us in ~2 days. We aren't exactly in a high-chargeback industry either, Stripe say our chargeback rate is well under the norm for our industry. Paypal was just a complete non-starter for us.

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#196
post #152

Paypal is a classic rent seeker. Nearly two years into pandemic, they still refuse to hire people for live customer service. Despite record profit. If anyone is looking for a startup idea: an online payment platform that charges on outbound bank transfers only. Heck charge 5% fee. And let all transactions be completely free.

That exists - wise.com.

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#198
post #3

I have seen absolutely zero coverage about this change so I wanted to make sure people knew about it. The change seems to have happened on August 2nd according to archive.org [1]. I checked my PayPal records to verify this was true and sure enough I've been paying the higher rate in fees starting after July. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20210727095034/https://www.paypa...

They technically announced it [1], but I agree that it got next to no coverage. Presumably they deliberately "silently" put the announcement on their blog without circulating it to news outlets. HN discussion at the time [2]. [1] https://newsroom.paypal-corp.com/2021-06-18-Upcoming-Changes... [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27560616

I have a merchant account with PayPal for my side business. I received an email notifying me of the change. I presume this is legally required for this sort of change to the terms.

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#199
post #189

When I moved to the Netherlands, I was at first irritated that my credit cards weren't accepted anywhere. But as the debit (maestro) card transactions are often free [1], paying 3%+ to a card service does seem exorbitant. For online payments, the Dutch use the IDEAL system, which is even easier than online credit cards. This also prevents vendor lock-in, like Amazon. And, the banking apps make it super easy to send m…

> Looking back, I have to imagine that this 3%+ tax on all American transactions must put a weight on the system. I 100% agree. It's pretty absurd that all merchants have to pay a 3% fee on the vast majority of their transactions with no real alternative. And I realize crypto gets a bad rap around here, but I really do think stablecoins offer an interesting way around this. It's an open standard that anyone can build…

> (and before someone yells "crypto fees", there are already solutions that can drive these well below $0.01 if we're just sending payments between 2 parties)

Can you specify what you're referring to? As someone who frequently yells "crypto fees" my understanding is most low-fee options either (a) require transfers within a centralized ecosystem, (b) aren't likely to scale effectively as a system (e.g. bitcoin's lightning network, or a shitcoin network of choice that's never experienced heavy usage) (c) are exciting but hypothetical future ideas, such as sharding on Ethereum

Re: PayPal raises fees for most domestic transaction types to 3.49% + $0.49

#200
post #152

Paypal is a classic rent seeker. Nearly two years into pandemic, they still refuse to hire people for live customer service. Despite record profit. If anyone is looking for a startup idea: an online payment platform that charges on outbound bank transfers only. Heck charge 5% fee. And let all transactions be completely free.

That exists - wise.com.

I don’t think so.
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