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Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

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Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#191

Post by tupputuppu »

atoav wrote: post #182
brigandish wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Do we have to show tolerance to the intolerant?" is not the newest question in the book Lately it seems to be the most misrepresented part of Popper's "paradox of intolerance", where he defines intolerance as those who resort to violence instead of speech, and the would be censors of this age who bring up the paradox - without seeming to have read it - tell us that the intolerant are those we disagree with. "we" b…

I am quite convinced Popper would have disagreed that the line doesn't needs to be drawn (in some cases) before violence — at least this is what I learned about him when I studied philosophy in Vienna, the city where he grew up in. Popper e.g. also says that the goal of elections is to have a transfer of power without having to have civil wars, guillotines and other violent means. This means to prevent violence we ha…

Popper's idea was that people need to be free to discuss and debate different perspectives. When most people don't feel free to voice their opinions I think it's safe to say the culture and institutions we have don't support that goal.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#192

Post by whamlastxmas »

Cass wrote: post #50
ColanR wrote: post #2

And this is why it's so important to maintain basic civility to everyone, regardless of political views.

There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility. An easy litmus test: are you advocating harm to a person for merely existing in the world, living with the skin color and sexuality they were born with, or making choices that don't harm anyone else? Then I have no interest in hearing your toxic and hateful opinion and I sure hope you'll be afraid to voice it around me. It's a great t…

The problem is that "advocating harm" is extremely dependent on perspective. Hard left would say anyone opposed to single payer healthcare is advocating harm. Or that landlords are advocating harm by commodifying something people die without.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#193

Post by mc32 »

gus_massa wrote: post #174
koheripbal wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how traffic laws work. It's a campaign bus, not voters at a polling station. Drivers supporting another party are absolutely allowed to drive next to them.

I don't know the local laws, but isn't there a minimal distance between cars in the runway? The truck was too close to the bus.

Tailgating is a thing, but so is not merging when unsafe to merge as well as splitting lanes is a thing you should not do (motorcycles excepted in some states).

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#194

Post by whamlastxmas »

ghthor wrote: post #133
cycomanic wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile a convoy of armed Trump supporters literally tried to run the Biden campaign bus off the road [1]. That's the reality Trump supporters are using fascist tactics (and I'm not exaggerating here, these acts are rightbout of a fascist playbook) while complaining that liberals say mean things to them. [1] https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.dailymail.co.uk/new... BTW there are reports that police refused to…

I wouldn't help the Biden campaign either if I was police, after they stocked the flames of a movement that literally chanted about wrapping cops up and setting them on fire.

Biden has been extremely pro-cop every time a person of color is murdered by police

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#195

Post by GreenWatermelon »

runawaybottle wrote: post #48
peteretep wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think millennials might be quite a case study on bad parenting, because Gen Z are literally turning out to be bad apples. Gen Z are the kids of Gen X, not millennials

Thanks for correcting. Gen X gets the least amount of flak compared to boomers, millennials and Gen Z, so that is interesting. It’s not easy raising kids for sure, but it’s almost like you have to be callous to not understand what kinda rat race the working world can be, and how hyper competitive even the shittiest of jobs are. Why are these values not being passed down? Usually, children of working immigrants see ho…

I would say there has to be some mandatory parenting classes you have to take before getting married/having kids, just like driving and driving school.

The vast majority of people know fuckall about parenting, and in turn raise disfunctional kids that know nothing about proper parenting, and the cycle continues.

Intervention is needed, in the form of teaching better parenting.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#196

Post by another_sock »

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #186
koheripbal wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I applaud your ability to keep politics out of work. We created a hard rule at our company in 2016: No politics / No religion. Most humans are incapable of discussing these topics rationally, and it only serves to increase division at work. One person could not handle the idea of not being politically active at work, and we discovered after she quit that almost everyone was happier no having her toxic commentary omni…

Your comment belies pretty repressive, judgmental, arrogant and close-minded attributes on your part. This attitude reminds me of the military’s “don’t ask, don’t tell” repression policy against gay service members. People should feel they don’t have to unnaturally switch off core important parts of their identity at work. They need to have psychological safety to outwardly “be themselves” - without burden to exert e…

Most humans can't discuss those topics rationally. It's not arrogant to say this, it's just basic truth. Throughout history, work hasn't been a social club, because everybody has a different preferred social environment and if you add in a social club then the thing people are getting paid for (work) is much harder to focus on. Your comment itself shows how passionate you are about political or social issues, which is fine for you if that is how you wish to proceed in life, but work is not the place for the emotionalism that is paired with passion for 99% of people. Left wing, right wing, authoritarian, libertarian, liberal, communist, fascist, etc doesn't matter, work is best done separated by those can put aside those motivations while working and focus on whatever it is they're being paid to work on.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#197

Post by whamlastxmas »

GreenWatermelon wrote: post #195
runawaybottle wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for correcting. Gen X gets the least amount of flak compared to boomers, millennials and Gen Z, so that is interesting. It’s not easy raising kids for sure, but it’s almost like you have to be callous to not understand what kinda rat race the working world can be, and how hyper competitive even the shittiest of jobs are. Why are these values not being passed down? Usually, children of working immigrants see ho…

I would say there has to be some mandatory parenting classes you have to take before getting married/having kids, just like driving and driving school. The vast majority of people know fuckall about parenting, and in turn raise disfunctional kids that know nothing about proper parenting, and the cycle continues. Intervention is needed, in the form of teaching better parenting.

A lifetime of living with your own dysfunctional parents is not going to be solved by a single class. Parenting issues seem largely generational

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#198

Post by michaelt »

vostok wrote: post #29
thesuperbigfrog wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not destruction of the middle ground, but rather hiding of the middle ground. Moderates do not feel safe to express moderate views for fear of being ostracized and cancelled.

Do you have any links to examples of moderate views that will get one cancelled? I would be really interested in this topic.

Maybe it doesn't rise to the level of 'cancelled' but a few decades ago you were taking a progressive, modern, left-wing stance if you said:

* These cases of minority students with 1600 on the SAT not being offered places in top colleges are bad. College admissions and grading should be name- race- and gender-blind.

* These cases of people trying to ban gay media and speakers for 'obscenity' or 'outraging public decency' are bad. People should be able to publish what they like, and colleges certainly shouldn't ban invited speakers, even if some students find their views challenging.

* These people writing about computers and always referring to the user as 'he' is pretty out of date. Generous use of 'they' in preference to gendered pronouns is the inclusive choice.

The same stances, when viewed from a few decades later, sound right-wing: To modern ears, those stances oppose affirmative action, oppose no-platforming, and say it's OK to ignore people's preferred pronouns. To some, those views would sound positively Jordan Peterson-esque.

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#199

Post by cozuya »

nautilus12 wrote: post #106
Cass wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility. An easy litmus test: are you advocating harm to a person for merely existing in the world, living with the skin color and sexuality they were born with, or making choices that don't harm anyone else? Then I have no interest in hearing your toxic and hateful opinion and I sure hope you'll be afraid to voice it around me. It's a great t…

"There's plenty of political views so toxic and harmful they don't deserve civility." The people that you think don't deserve civility in this scenario literally have the exact same viewpoint. This is the disconnect and it goes both ways. Unless its straight up illegal, civility should always apply.

For the most part, advocating for racism, sexism, white supremacy, and Nazism is not illegal. Should we be civil with people who are in favor of them?

Re: Poll: 62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Afraid to Share

#200

Post by whamlastxmas »

jariel wrote: post #146
vostok wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any links to examples of moderate views that will get one cancelled? I would be really interested in this topic.

? Most cancellations are of moderates. JK Rowling's view that Women, and Men who transition to women, while they should have 'equal rights' - are not the same thing, that there is a difference and that difference should be respected - got her cancelled. They are out for here in droves. This is a mainstream view and probably extremely popular. In fact, outside of hyperbolic politics I'll be basically anyone that even…

Please don't sympathize with transphobes
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