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Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

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Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#191

Post by mcv »

magduf wrote: post #160
SamWhited wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This post may sound flippant and is getting a lot of down votes, but this seems like an interesting discussion to be had. Do we (I am from the U.S.) tend to allow companies to screw us more than other countries? If so is it cultural, or something legal? Is it part of our broader convenience culture? I don't now, but it would be interesting to dig into if anyone can provide evidence for or against this.

I think, absolutely yes. Americans generally are opposed to regulation of corporations, especially conservative ones, and most especially ones that have a libertarian streak.

But they're totally fine with regulation of people, interestingly enough. Maybe not the real libertarians, but certainly the conservatives.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#192

Post by pgeorgi »

baroffoos wrote: post #188
umvi wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That happened to my Chromebook too, so I just installed GalliumOS on it, and it's been getting updates regularly for over a year now.

The problem is even though we can do this, the average user doesn't. They get the unsupported message and they then throw the laptop in the bin and buy the same thing again. All electronics makers should be required by law to supply security updates and spare parts for devices for at least 10 years after the point of sale (not after the release date). Another thing I think would have a big impact is requiring all con…

> All electronics makers should be required by law to supply security updates and spare parts for devices for at least 10 years after the point of sale (not after the release date).

Let's start by requiring then that chip vendors sell and support their chips for at least that long?

To stick to "10 years since introduction to market" which is a much easier requirement: 2009 was the year of AMD Phenom II (EOL 2012) and Intel Nehalem (EOL around 2012), and Qualcomm MSM7227 (couldn't find EOL date, but its direct successor came out 2011).

How much stock should they keep around for the 10 extra years after 3 years on the market? (and what happens if they underprovision, will they be sued, or overprovision, throw it all in the bin? they can't sell it, or the 10 year clock starts again)

> to have a user accessible method for replacing the battery. This used to be standard with all consumer electronics until very recently.

... and then vendors sold thinner and thinner devices, and customers preferred them over the others. The only way to get the same mileage out of a thinner device is to put batteries in every nook you can find, which doesn't work so well if the battery is supposed to be a single replaceable part. Also, there are two layers of plastic (chassis, battery container) that take away space that could be better used to store energy.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#193

Post by takeda »

eastof wrote: post #20
ISL wrote: post #14

Right to repair is increasingly hitting people outside of agrarian/industrial contexts. This month, Google shipped the last update for my Pixel phone. The hardware is functional and in great shape, but I don't think there are any truly viable ways for me to keep it secure. I have a tablet that long-ago met the same fate. This is in the same world where I can 'apt-get update' my seven-year old desktop and work with ap…

You can get really good support from Lineage OS for years to come. Been running it on all my android devices for years. The flagship models like Pixel usually have the best ongoing support.

Are there any flagship models that still have phone jack and an sdcard?

Supposedly there's so many Android phones but all are removing things. You can get phones with these, but then their support doesn't last long and generally no one cares about maintaining a replacement OS like Lineage OS.

My ideal phone would have:

- size that does fit in a hand

- phone jack

- sdcard

- hardware keyboard

- ir blaster

- stereo speakers that actually face the user

- work with frequencies of my cell provider

- easy to root

- good battery life

- easy to open and fix

- recent hardware (I rarely play games but want it to be responsive)

But since then I started giving up on some features though those 3 are still important to me.

It's impossible to find one that has all of those things now, the only phones that I owned and really like and were very close to ideal were Motorola Droid 1, and HTC One M8 and it feels like it only goes downhill.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#194

Post by FactolSarin »

aguyfromnb wrote: post #47
ISL wrote: post #14

Right to repair is increasingly hitting people outside of agrarian/industrial contexts. This month, Google shipped the last update for my Pixel phone. The hardware is functional and in great shape, but I don't think there are any truly viable ways for me to keep it secure. I have a tablet that long-ago met the same fate. This is in the same world where I can 'apt-get update' my seven-year old desktop and work with ap…

> This month, Google shipped the last update for my Pixel phone. The hardware is functional and in great shape, but I don't think there are any truly viable ways for me to keep it secure. The same thing happened recently with the Chromebook I purchased for my significant other. She's a very light computer user, so we thought it was a perfect device. It was great, until one day she received a message saying, essential…

Microsoft products get supported basically forever. But they're not cool/trendy.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#195

Post by elihu »

userbinator wrote: post #181
elihu wrote: post #50

> The measure adopted by the Nebraska Farm Bureau laid out specific standards for any agreement or legislation: > Right to Repair: Nebraska Farm Bureau supports the implementation of comprehensive right to repair legislation OR a negotiated written agreement between ag producers and original equipment manufacturers (OEMs). This legislation or agreement must: .... > 4. Differentiate between repair (the restoration of…

The EPA has always had laws about environmental controls (whether people care about them is a different issue, however...), so it's not something any new laws should really need to cover.

Also, a user may conceivably want to convert diesel equipment to be electric.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#196

Post by takeda »

Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #126
ISL wrote: post #14

Right to repair is increasingly hitting people outside of agrarian/industrial contexts. This month, Google shipped the last update for my Pixel phone. The hardware is functional and in great shape, but I don't think there are any truly viable ways for me to keep it secure. I have a tablet that long-ago met the same fate. This is in the same world where I can 'apt-get update' my seven-year old desktop and work with ap…

Librem phones can't come soon enough.

The issue there is that you're missing the app ecosystem. Without it, why not just use a "dumb" phone?

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#197

Post by takeda »

blacksmith_tb wrote: post #183
netsharc wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ordered a cheap Android phone the other day because installing a non-OEM OS like Lineage mean... banking software doesn't work. I have an older phone but the last stock ROM on it is Android 5, although it is currently running Lineage with Android 9. So I bought that phone to keep at stock and have a phone I can do my banking with. Come to think of it, I should just switch banks!

Magisk[1] works with Lineage and might be able to fool your annoying banking app. 1: https://forum.xda-developers.com/apps/magisk/official-magisk...

Don't use Magisk, but it allowed me to fool all apps that I'm aware of.

I really don't understand this mentality (doing it with a bank app, I also had it with OTP app), because I have full control over my phone that somehow makes it compromised?

What's next? I no longer will have access to my bank account because I'm less trustworthy?

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#198

Post by takeda »

netsharc wrote: post #67
eastof wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get really good support from Lineage OS for years to come. Been running it on all my android devices for years. The flagship models like Pixel usually have the best ongoing support.

I ordered a cheap Android phone the other day because installing a non-OEM OS like Lineage mean... banking software doesn't work. I have an older phone but the last stock ROM on it is Android 5, although it is currently running Lineage with Android 9. So I bought that phone to keep at stock and have a phone I can do my banking with. Come to think of it, I should just switch banks!

The Magisk recommendation should work, but you should put pressure on your bank to stop doing it.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#199

Post by ShroudedNight »

Balanceinfinity wrote: post #137
bduerst wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When buying, if there are contractual strings attached to the use of the asset then it's more of a lease purchase than actual asset purchase. As it is now, farmers that are purchasing the asset are saying they want to use the asset as they deem fit, including repairs.

agreed. But when they purchased the machines, they should have looked at the services terms and taken that into account when making their purchases. If there's competition in the market (no idea) then presumably someone would try to beat its competitors by offering a better service option (such as unlocked diagnostics). This issue went to the supreme court on the question of whether a manufacturer could "monopolize"…

Link is missing the trailing period:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastman_Kodak_Co._v._Image_Tec....

FWIW, I had to add an extra period at the end to get the original one to get included as part of the link.

Re: Nebraska farmers vote overwhelmingly for Right to Repair

#200

Post by bobbean »

snowron6 wrote: post #33
eastof wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get really good support from Lineage OS for years to come. Been running it on all my android devices for years. The flagship models like Pixel usually have the best ongoing support.

Really? There's been no support for the pixel since the first one. It sucks, I'd love to run lineage on my pixel 2.

Honest question, what use would Lineage be on a pixel? I've used it a few times for older phones, but that was mainly to get rid of a bunch of the stupid restrictions and bloatware those phones had. Pixel phones seem like they wouldn't benefit too much from it. (Again I haven't looked into it in a while so I'm not sure of the benefits)
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