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SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

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Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#191

Post by bilbo0s »

saiya-jin wrote: post #159
djsumdog wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

Sour comment for whatever reason... It's actually pretty simple - imagine the world that is and probably will be with him, and then one without him. We underdogs hate to be not credited for the hard work we do, but his positive impact on mankind as a whole is quite substantial, and as time goes by it will be only magnified. Hard to argue with this. SpaceX and Tesla are really a bit more than just a sum of all the eng…

The world with him, is a whole lot like the world without him though.

I mean, I did the thought experiment, and I honestly don't see many things that would be different?

Are you arguing that without Musk, we wouldn't have commercial space companies, or electric cars? If so, I find that a bit difficult to believe.

The part of your comment about no one being a hero is correct. None of us are any better than anyone else, that's for sure. (It's the main reason I try never to point fingers in life actually.) But the idea that we would be worse off without Musk is just a bridge too far.

Even a world absent Steve Jobs, would have created PCs and smart phones. And, with respect to impact, Musk is no Steve Jobs.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#192

Post by Rooster61 »

I very much hate to see this. Not for Musk's sake, as he has been pretty much asking for something like this to happen. I hate it because of the damage it will do to Tesla and SpaceX when he's likely banned from leading a company.

Tesla's not exactly lighting the world on fire in terms of potential long term success, but SpaceX really has been doing well in recent years. The fact that they are already refurbishing solid rocket boosters is a BIG deal. Losing a CEO is a very turbulent thing, and this will only set back their progress towards affordable space flight. I hope both companies are already grooming a suitable replacement.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#193

Post by toomuchtodo »

spookthesunset wrote: post #183
toomuchtodo wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Owning about 12k shares of TSLA, having followed the company closely since inception (when it was ran by Martin Eberhard and Marc Tarpenning), I can't see Tesla succeeding without Musk. It'll end up acquired, or as a boutique manufacturer like Ferrari. Tesla's value is Musk's determination. Still, he needs to choose his actions more wisely, clearly.

> Owning about 12k shares of TSLA If only all of the TSLA fanboys posted how much money they have on the line. After reading this, all the rest of your comments suddenly make sense. Pro Tip: Don't get emotional over your investments or you are gonna lose the ability to think rationally and get burned.

I'm financially independent without my Tesla holdings. If it all goes to zero, I'm prepared for that.

If being a fanboy of a company working towards positive change in the world (which is so very often rare, unfortunately) is wrong, I don't want to be right. Everyone finds meaning in different ways. This is my small contribution.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#194

Post by ucaetano »

londons_explore wrote: post #174
rifung wrote: post #119

"The suit seeks an order from a judge barring Musk from serving as an officer or director of a public company, a request often made in SEC lawsuits, as well as unspecified monetary penalties." Does this imply that they want to remove him from being CEO and from the board of directors?

Or to simply make it a private company and stay CEO...

> make it a private company and stay CEO

Yeah, with what money?

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#195

Post by philwelch »

buboard wrote: post #81
rhema wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He may deserve that, but I believe that public perception is that Elon Musk is Tesla. In the same way that Bill Gates was Microsoft and Steve Jobs was Apple, Musk commands a huge moral force (in a Clausewitz sense... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_von_Clausewitz ). Fire Musk and you need to hire a press team, rebrand, and basically become seen as a stuffy company instead of the hip trendy up-and-comer. How much p…

The difference with Gates and Jobs is Tesla has not delivered, i.e. it has not become profitable enough to guarantee success in the future. At this point he's indispensable. (There is also the thought that without him Tesla does not have an advantage vs cheaper competitors from all around the world)

> Tesla has not delivered, i.e. it has not become profitable enough to guarantee success in the future

And based on that track record, in addition to violating security laws, you conclude that Musk is essential to the business? Strange.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#197

Post by smt88 »

Rooster61 wrote: post #192

I very much hate to see this. Not for Musk's sake, as he has been pretty much asking for something like this to happen. I hate it because of the damage it will do to Tesla and SpaceX when he's likely banned from leading a company. Tesla's not exactly lighting the world on fire in terms of potential long term success, but SpaceX really has been doing well in recent years. The fact that they are already refurbishing so…

Get a new, non-founding CEO has worked wonders for lots of companies. There are very few (possibly zero) people who are "the only person for the job".

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#198

Post by ucaetano »

drawkbox wrote: post #96
smacktoward wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet Gates is gone, and Microsoft is still here. And Jobs is gone, but Apple is still here. As the saying goes, the graveyards are full of indispensable men.

If Jobs hadn't of gone back to Apple in '97 after being fired in '85, they wouldn't be here today. Jobs was their last hope after Sculley made them mediocre. Apple was down to relying on a 150m investment from Microsoft in the late 90s (Aug 1997), that they probably only got because of Jobs [1]. I'd also argue everything that Jobs had created at NeXTSTEP became Apple and saved them [2]. The technology made it all the…

> Tesla is an engineer first

Nah, Tesla is a Twitter-first. Engineers seem to hate working there and are constantly leaving because of the PR obsessions.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#199

Post by chrisco255 »

gamblor956 wrote: post #185
chrisco255 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are few leaders in the business world as capable as Musk. Would we even be having this conversation without Twitter? Social media considered harmful.

Most business leaders in the world are far more capable than Musk at actually running successful companies. You just don't hear about them because they spend their time running their companies or with their families instead of bragging about what a great job they're doing on twitter. (Here's a hint: if you have to publicly brag about doing a great job, you really aren't.)

No, they're not. If they did, they'd be making headlines. A lot of execs are good at extracting value from pre-established business models, but few would have the intuition, intelligence, and risk-taking capacity to create the kind of innovative companies that Musk has.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#200

Post by Delphiki »

vkou wrote: post #65
neaden wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Honestly, what does Musk bring right now? If Tesla's product is good, if it's technology is good why shouldn't they succeed without Musk providing an inconvenient distraction.

The thing is, the product is not good, yet. They've yet to ship a $35,000 car, they've yet to hit their production goals, they've yet to justify their sky-high valuation, and their current build quality is below what one would expect for a $50,000 car. This doesn't mean that failing to fix those problems will kill Tesla. It may, however, cause a large drop in stock price, massive losses for shareholders at large, and…

I've owned two Model 3s, and while this is anecdotal at best, I've found the build quality to be excellent in both of them. I have coworkers that drive BMWs and Audis that have ridden in my Model 3 and commented that the car feels very solid.
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