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SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

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Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#151

Post by [deleted] »

tomphoolery wrote: post #80
ivraatiems wrote: post #15

A short while ago (per my comment history), I asked whether Elon Musk should remain as CEO of Tesla. I think, for my part, the answer is clearly no. He might be brilliant, he has undeniably had a hand in creating something awesome with Tesla and SpaceX's technology, but he's now a danger to the very thing he helped build. This is just one of the lawsuits filed against him or Tesla in recent weeks that have him as the…

Ousting Elon Musk will only make Tesla's eventual takeover of the auto industry take longer. Tesla will have a "John Scully" character who ruins/devalues the whole company to the point where Elon can buy it back, then he will take the company so far that it makes every other auto manufacturer obsolete.

[deleted]

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#152

Post by maxxxxx »

djsumdog wrote: post #68
chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

Totally agree. He makes it sound like he is the guy who figures out all that stuff in his basement. It's hard to imagine that a CEO of two companies that size has the time to do any real engineering. He seems more the type who has good memory and can repeat what the engineered are telling him. My VP is like that. He immediately comprehends and remembers what you tell him but he is not doing any development work.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#153

Post by beamatronic »

rayiner wrote: post #128
drawkbox wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Elon Musk is removed as CEO at Tesla, Tesla is over. I find it curious that an innovative American company pushing to help our carbon problem by going electric is so lambasted, shorted, constantly under attack. It cannot be argued that Tesla pushed forward both electric cars and self-driving vehicles as a major force (original self-driving push was a DoD X-Prize) Personally I like when American companies succeed a…

> It cannot be argued that Tesla pushed forward both electric cars and self-driving vehicles as a major force (original self-driving push was a DoD X-Prize Sure it can. Tesla has done basically nothing for self-driving cars, it's technology is glorified lane-keeping. As to electric cars, the Model S is the third best-selling electric car ever, after the Nissan Leaf and the Chevy Volt. Both of those cars were introduc…

An electric 4WD minivan would be nice too.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#154

Post by rleigh »

drawkbox wrote: post #55
arawde wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not shorted because of its mission, its shorted because of the negative cash flow. Musks' public persona doesn't exactly give off the aura of a man who has his companies operating expenses and profitability under control.

Obviously car companies are hard to run. Though internet companies aren't the best at cash flow management either, it is more about getting the market / customers then the profit. I think innovation is excusable for revenue/profits for some time. Starting an electric car ONLY car company is even harder than having it as part of an existing car company like Mercedes is doing well with. The shorts are mainly trying to…

I imagine they are hard to run. But they don't require "genius" to run, they require people skilled in process management, supply chain operations, assembly automation and the rest. The stuff all the other big car manufacturers have been doing for decades. All stuff that Musk doesn't have a background in.

What makes Tesla unique in this respect, and Musk so essential to the operations?

I'd argue nothing at all, other than his image. Hire some experts from the other companies, people with a few decades of experience, and let them turn it around. Maybe start with why you're hand-assembling and gluing things together in tents, rather than using the high efficiency production lines everyone else is using.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#155

Post by jeffreyrogers »

empath75 wrote: post #12
chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

You say the shorts don't have any power to hurt tesla, but much of tesla's and elon musk's personal debt is backed by Tesla shares. If the price dips too low, it's potentially catastrophic for the company and him.

Shorts don't affect the stock the price that way. They profit if the price goes down, sure. And lots of short interest might make people more likely to sell, which will drive the price down, but just shorting a stock doesn't have much effect on the price.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#156

Post by sho_hn »

browsercoin wrote: post #69

I'm perplexed how Musk could act without thinking of the consequences? Now I fear that he will be banned from SpaceX as well, when you are convicted of fraud by SEC, it will impact your duties at other companies. It takes decades to build a reputation but it can be destroyed overnight with a single tweet.

I'm curious about the possible ramifications for SpaceX as well. That said, it is a private company.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#157

Post by bilbo0s »

ravenstine wrote: post #10
NN88 wrote: post #5

Twitter is like keeping a loaded gun in the house with kids. Politicians, Business leaders, community influencers... BEWARE

(removed)

>A world where your entire life has to be squeaky clean in order to achieve anything above-average is not one I want to live in...

We always lived in that world, it's only extent of the checks that have changed.

Outside of a national security context, a background check in 1950 entailed an inquiry with the local constabulary and citizenry about your character. Maybe a cursory check to make sure you were current on your bills. (And of course, a check to make sure you didn't get a dishonorable.) By 1980, the check on bills had been formalized into a credit check, and the check with the local constabulary had been formalized into a nationwide criminal record search. Today, we're approaching the point where we can formalize the inquiry with local citizenry as to the content of a person's character, but every other check is still made. (Try to find a decent job if you have a dishonorable, or a criminal record.)

Point is, previous generations have always had the problem of companies wanting to know more about us than we wanted to share. It's just that not many other generations would have foolishly volunteered all of that information to companies. We did.

I've got even worse news for you, as you might imply from my little timeline above, background checks will get better and better as time goes on. It's just the world we live in. It's the world we've always lived in.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#158

Post by compcoffee »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #42
burke wrote: post #30

On one hand, the $420 tweet was just blatantly obviously a bad idea and he should have known better. On the other hand, it feels... strange somehow that a joke (if a slightly deadpan one) has consequences this severe. It affected the markets and it obviously wasn't without real-world consequences in any case, but something about this all just feels a little off somehow.

I wonder if they will be able to demonstrate that any damage was actually done. The $420 tweet had a reverse effect in the end, not what most people would expect from such a tweet.

>I wonder if they will be able to demonstrate that any damage was actually done.

This case is unique in that both shorts and longs were harmed. Plenty to go around. How many people bought shares at ~$350 assuming they'd be private at $420 because the CEO said so?

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#159

Post by saiya-jin »

djsumdog wrote: post #68
chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

Sour comment for whatever reason... It's actually pretty simple - imagine the world that is and probably will be with him, and then one without him.

We underdogs hate to be not credited for the hard work we do, but his positive impact on mankind as a whole is quite substantial, and as time goes by it will be only magnified. Hard to argue with this. SpaceX and Tesla are really a bit more than just a sum of all the engineers (and other folks) involved.

If you like to pick negative things on people, then there are no heroes, there are no ideals to look up to. Every single great person in history had a dark side, like it or not. I guess that's part of what makes us humans.

Personally, I like him. With all the warts, emotions and whatnot. Results matter, rest are details for pub discussion after 5th beer. World generally thinks similarly on this topic.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#160

Post by _ea1k »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #90
ryandrake wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s wrong with someone else stepping in to run things? Why is E.M. the one person out of 7 billion on Earth who can possibly run the company? People said the same thing about Jobs, but here Apple is, still printing money.

I think the primary fear is that he’d be replaced with a visionless drone and the company would cease to push any kind of bar, sliding into the same sort of profitable stagnancy found at every other American carmaker. The impact would be reduced now that the big guys are finally starting to take full electric seriously, but the impact would still be there. Without Tesla’s constant pressure I could see full BEV adopti…

I get that argument, but I'm pretty sure that a stagnant Tesla still ships the Semi, Model Y, the new Pickup Truck, that little something else that keeps getting whispered about, and maybe even the Roadster. Maybe the timeframes for each elongate by a few years, but there is still a pretty clear pathway to success.

And the cool thing? Elon Musk could join a competitor, grow them over 6 years, and leverage their sales to regain control of the business. That last bit is mostly joking, but good on you if you get history that it references.

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