Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics? • Hacker News Board

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#191

Post by Rescis » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 12:13 AM UTC

1000units wrote: post #132

gepi79 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It apparently can bring out already dormant mental illnesses but is not in any way associated with the formation of new mental illnesses. The victim does not know in advance. The victim does not care afterwards because the result is the same.

And how is he so confident it doesn't "form new illnesses," whatever that might mean? Like I've mentioned upthread, I've known a number of people who have clearly suffered from having tried LSD. Some of them will admit it was the worst decision they've ever made. Others will deny it, strongly encourage you to try it, and if you press them for how it might help you exactly they cannot explain, but there is a glimmer o…

> It's very chilling. It reminds me of how you'll see in some gay communities when someone contracts HIV they will compulsively spread it to as many people as possible.

Do you have a source for this?

Your claim seems like a very broad and negative generalizatuon of an entire group of diverse people, who are often marginalized.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#192

Post by deno » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 12:44 AM UTC

1000units wrote: post #190

deno wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone prone to alcoholism tries their first gateway alcoholic drink, becomes alcoholic, kills themselves and several other people in a drunk driving manslaughter. This is not hypothetical, it’s a much too common scenario. You’re praising the de facto drug of violence, comparable in social harm only to heroin, as “socially acceptable”, while grossly misrepresenting the actual harm potential of substances like LSD (“…

The blog linked above has some good information about how conditional probabilities work as well. I advise checking it out. Really enhances your ability to examine the world and arrive at sound insights if that's something you're interested in. (very much unlike LSD) To your last comment, maybe this is surprising, but I'm a teetotaler myself.

> very much unlike LSD

Have you ever tried LSD yourself?

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#193

Post by 1000units » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 12:57 AM UTC

Rescis wrote: post #191

1000units wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how is he so confident it doesn't "form new illnesses," whatever that might mean? Like I've mentioned upthread, I've known a number of people who have clearly suffered from having tried LSD. Some of them will admit it was the worst decision they've ever made. Others will deny it, strongly encourage you to try it, and if you press them for how it might help you exactly they cannot explain, but there is a glimmer o…

> It's very chilling. It reminds me of how you'll see in some gay communities when someone contracts HIV they will compulsively spread it to as many people as possible. Do you have a source for this? Your claim seems like a very broad and negative generalizatuon of an entire group of diverse people, who are often marginalized.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugchasing#References

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#194

Post by Simon_says » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 3:54 AM UTC

deadbunny wrote: post #152

ramblerman wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's a statement and a belief that IMO is very sensitive to confirmation bias. Are you saying people who no longer feel depressed are suffering from confirmation bias? :)

No, Surviorship Bias. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

That's a dark thought.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#195

Post by 1000units » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 5:02 AM UTC

deno wrote: post #192

1000units wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The blog linked above has some good information about how conditional probabilities work as well. I advise checking it out. Really enhances your ability to examine the world and arrive at sound insights if that's something you're interested in. (very much unlike LSD) To your last comment, maybe this is surprising, but I'm a teetotaler myself.

> very much unlike LSD Have you ever tried LSD yourself?

Of course not, are you nuts?

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#196

Post by deno » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 8:27 AM UTC

1000units wrote: post #195

deno wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> very much unlike LSD Have you ever tried LSD yourself?

Of course not, are you nuts?

You should.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#197

Post by qwerty456127 » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 8:50 AM UTC

Psychedelics are a good thing yet sure as hell not for everyone. I really doubt selling them freely in every supermarket is a good idea but I believe nobody should ever get arrested for possessing them nor even for producing them for personal consumption or sharing it with friends IMHO. I think Schedule IV is probably the most adequate status for things like LSD (which is safe physiologically but can harm some mentally sick people psyche/adequacy seriously). As for things like MDMA (which can hardly cause any psychological harm and only causes physiological harm if used improperly) or 6-APB (which has effects similar to those of MDMA but isn't known to inflict any harm at all) I would vote to legalize recreational use. And there also are some more exotic psychedelics like 5-MeO-DMT (don't confuse with regular DMT! ordinary DMT can indeed harm some people psyche though this doesn't happen often) that have little if any abuse potential for which I can see no reason to control them at all.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#198

Post by rimliu » Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 3:22 PM UTC

toomanybeersies wrote: post #80

rimliu wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, alcohol is trivial to make at home.

Marijuana is trivial to grow at home, yet it's still illegal in most of the world.

My point is that with alcohol is easy to circumvent the ban. And, just guessing, even easier than growing weed.

Re: Should We Loosen the Restrictions on Psychedelics?

#199

Post by spiralx » Fri, Jul 20, 2018, 10:11 AM UTC

justaaron wrote: post #44

xg15 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The main issue with these "laws" is that they are speculative Sorry to pull that quote out of context, but this is just peak HN. It's beautiful. > Psychedelics have been available and used throughout history with few problems in ritual settings So we should only allow them in ritual settings then? > The real reason psychedelics were banned in the US is to have a reason to jail politically inconvenient people in Vie…

coffee is regulated? the drug war is a politically and economically driven disaster that has created the single largest wave in history of disrespect for law, laws, and our legal systems. Law, as a system, draws 100% of it's authority from the notion of being an externalized codified form of social morality. The minute Law ceases being moral and becomes merely an obvious instrument of power it's basis flounders. If y…

Just wanted to say that I agree 100% with this, yet rarely hear it articulated elsewhere. The pernicious effects of pitting otherwise law-abiding people against the justice system and by proxy, the entire state, is something that I think has contributed a not insignificant part to the breakdown of community and subsequent alienation we're seeing today.

The police are supposed to be on our side, yet huge swathes of society must think of them as the 'enemy' because the law has made it so. It'll be at least a generation after legalisation, probably a couple of generations, before this toxic relationship gets healed, we can't start that process soon enough.