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Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

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Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#181

Post by dugidugout »

kayodelycaon wrote: post #117
cheald wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It still requires willpower, but to use a metaphor, it's much easier to travel down a well-trod path than it is to cut a new path through the jungle. Repetition and consistency establishes the path, so the willpower required to travel down it the next day is reduced over time. Establishing a pre-set time and committing to that time ahead of time removes the "will I or won't I" decision at "go time", when you're most…

This method requires a significant amount of executive function. My body doesn't feel the passage of time consistently. So my mind is never prepared to switch activities when it needs to. And there are times my brain stops working on a particular task and nothing can get it started again. It's like a leg going out, you just can't stand on it. This isn't occasionally where habit could be picked back up. This has been…

I struggle daily to urge myself to eat after years of habitual starvation. The process of storing and making food through-out the week is extremely difficult for me to say the least... I also don't have room in my finances to out-source this completely. To combat this, I have been successfully meal prepping on the weekends; however, I still often struggle with the basic task of eating the food, prepped and served. It is a common experience for me to get part-way into eating a dish, move on to another task, and neglect the food until it's spoiled only to realize so when I pack up for the day. Sometimes I will even notice the food, deep into a task, but the thought to address it is hardly formed.

In this regard neurotypical advice _did_ actually help me I suppose. However, when applied to a habit not immediately linked to your existence, it is quite alienating to receive.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#182

Post by astrange »

cgriswald wrote: post #171
smeej wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no question if I want to do it, it is set at that time and I have to do it, period. Gosh it must be nice to have at least an ordinary amount of executive function skills. Is it really this easy for neurotypical people to build routines? That's really all it takes? I don't see how this removes willpower at all. It just determines what time you have to use it.

Willpower is what you use when you’re allowed choice and know you should make the good choice but actually feel like choosing the bad choice. The trick to good discipline is to never allow it to be a choice. There are no excuses. There is no negotiation. It just is the same way the sun rises or the tax man comes. Good discipline is a skill you develop and it is far easier than trying to live via something as temperam…

You need some level of willpower to get your legs to take you to another place. Certainly if it involves getting in a car and parking.

If you don't have that, the skill needed to develop it is the skill to get someone to prescribe you amphetamines.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#183

Post by kayodelycaon »

machomaster wrote: post #175
kayodelycaon wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This method requires a significant amount of executive function. My body doesn't feel the passage of time consistently. So my mind is never prepared to switch activities when it needs to. And there are times my brain stops working on a particular task and nothing can get it started again. It's like a leg going out, you just can't stand on it. This isn't occasionally where habit could be picked back up. This has been…

Do you ever feel unmotivated to go to the toilet despite needing to? Has this lack of motivation ever stopped you from getting from your chair? What modern people usually lack is not time, but lack of energy. Usually this is thought as the energy to do stuff (like coding a side hussle in the evening). But often it manifests in a lack of energy: 1. to make a decision (to do something) 2. to slow down, to stop the curr…

I really don’t like being snarky here but this is an absolutely perfect example of what I was talking about in my last paragraph.

I didn’t mention energy because energy has no relevance.

I’ve literally broken down crying because I really wanted to work but my brain refused to move. I was having such a great day and was really motivated. I spend hours and absolutely exhausted every bit of energy I had trying every advice that I’ve spent my entire life hearing. I could not get a single word out of my brain.

Nothing worked. I spent my entire childhood trying harder and got nowhere. I probably shouldn’t say this, but I get quite pissed off when people tell me to try hard harder.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#184

Post by lifetimerubyist »

gehsty wrote: post #19

If it helps anyone I take antidepressants and have had a positive experience with them. Depression can be caused by a chemical imbalance and no amount of exercise or talking about it will fix it. One of the most frustrating things when your really low is people giving advice like do exercise to feel better - please don’t do this.

The hypothesis of chemical imbalance causing depression is mostly discredited.

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2022/jul/analysis-depression-prob...

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#185

Post by jjulius »

BoneShard wrote: post #180
bluerooibos wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All you need to do is go to sleep before 12 every single night and wake up at 7am without fail, hit the gym and crank out a few sets of squats, hit the pool and the sauna, read a chapter of that book, and then cook yourself an amazing breakfast, all before 9am. If you're a real go-getter, though, you'd wake up at 6am and do some vibe coding for an hour on that side hustle. Super simple.

and not have any kids.

Nah, you can do it with kids! I have two that are about to be 4 and 6, here are my weekdays:

- Alarm at 4:30. 5 mins of breathing exercises, 20 mins of meditation.

- Make coffee, have breakfast, out the door to work by ~5:30.

- Get to work's gym by 5:45, cardio for 60 mins.

- In my office by 7:00-7:15.

- 3:30, 25 mins of breathe work and meditation again. Tuesdays and Thursdays, this is 3:15 so I can fit in ~30 mins of strength training.

- Head on out, pick up my youngest from school, home by ~4:15-4:30-ish. Ballpark depending on traffic, actual gym times, etc.

- Cook dinner (kiddos often like to help), eat with family, hang out with and play with my kiddos until 7:00PM.

- Kiddo bath and bed time, wife and I take turns doing this every night. Whether I'm "done" at 7 or 8, it only takes me ~30 mins to shower and prep my shit (clothes, lunch, etc.) for the next day.

- Leaves me with ~1-2 hours each night to hang out, read a book, and enjoy my wife's company before heading to bed at ~9:30.

It's busy, but I don't feel like I'm overstretched and I don't feel like it leaves me missing out on anything.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#186

Post by [deleted] »

cheald wrote: post #2

This is a finding that keeps coming up, and I've certainly found it true in my life, but there's a significant chicken-and-egg problem in that depression frequently precludes the motivation to exercise, and if you don't already have a deeply-disciplined routine to overcome the lack of motivation, people won't do it. Exhortation to develop those good habits in the good times, I suppose.

[deleted]

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#187

Post by znpy »

I’m here ti add my own anecdotal two cents:

2024 has been a rough year. I didn’t begin any real recover until around march-may 2025… when i started going yo the gym and lifting weights. Yeah sure i’m doing therapy and all that jazz but the real improvements started with weight lifting.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#188

Post by kayodelycaon »

technothrasher wrote: post #159
kayodelycaon wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This method requires a significant amount of executive function. My body doesn't feel the passage of time consistently. So my mind is never prepared to switch activities when it needs to. And there are times my brain stops working on a particular task and nothing can get it started again. It's like a leg going out, you just can't stand on it. This isn't occasionally where habit could be picked back up. This has been…

I would imagine you'd get this advice from other non-neurotypical people too. My son is neurodivergant, and strict routine like what is being described is about the only thing that keeps him able to handle most daily life tasks regularly. But plenty of other advice he constantly gets frustrates him similarly to the frustration you seem to be describing. We call it "you've just never had it cooked right" advice. So I…

I call it the “loadbearing just”. :) “if you’ve just did this”

Most neurodivergent people I’ve met accept my limitations and don’t expect what works for them to work for me. It might take a little explanation but they didn’t seem to get upset about it.

The few that have expected me to be like them, expected other people to be like them as well. So it wasn’t specific to me.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#189

Post by taeric »

yomismoaqui wrote: post #68
cheald wrote: post #2

This is a finding that keeps coming up, and I've certainly found it true in my life, but there's a significant chicken-and-egg problem in that depression frequently precludes the motivation to exercise, and if you don't already have a deeply-disciplined routine to overcome the lack of motivation, people won't do it. Exhortation to develop those good habits in the good times, I suppose.

Motivation is fleeting but routine persists. When there is something that you want to do regularly (exercise, doing the final boring part of some sideproject, cleaning the house...) you remove willpower from the equation and set a day and a time. For example, everyday from 18 to 19 I work on my sideprojects, or saturdays from 16 to 18 is house cleaning time. There is no question if I want to do it, it is set at that…

As someone that is unable to keep any sort of routine, I have objections here. :D Without some sort of obligating circumstance, it is incredibly easy to forego what would have otherwise been today's routine.

Re: Exercise can be nearly as effective as therapy for depression

#190

Post by keybored »

jjulius wrote: post #185
BoneShard wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and not have any kids.

Nah, you can do it with kids! I have two that are about to be 4 and 6, here are my weekdays: - Alarm at 4:30. 5 mins of breathing exercises, 20 mins of meditation. - Make coffee, have breakfast, out the door to work by ~5:30. - Get to work's gym by 5:45, cardio for 60 mins. - In my office by 7:00-7:15. - 3:30, 25 mins of breathe work and meditation again. Tuesdays and Thursdays, this is 3:15 so I can fit in ~30 mins…

-
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