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I'm sorry

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Re: I'm sorry

#181

Post by xunn0026 »

avsteele wrote: post #152

I am not versed in all the details here, but it is clear there is a diverge of expectations between MS and some of the repo owners. This is just part of business. Legal agreements and projects are complicated. Not everything is going to be spelled out. In a good business relationship you acknowledge this and work in good faith to resolve differences when they occur. However, top comments make clear there is a dire ne…

Excuse me? The post is a non-apology. It starts with a minor PR while in fact it turns out to be about the whole organizational structure which was a surprise to people that joined it?! This is a fundamental problem, not a minor PR and how the process for merging that is.

As for emotions and business you are also quite wrong. Emotions will give you some pretty good hints about reality. Ignoring those and trying to be 'productive' is a sure way of being tricked all the way to the bank. There's a reason emotions exist and to lobotomise yourself won't make you a better business person.

Re: I'm sorry

#182

Post by dusted »

Such politics and drama... over what? was the merged code bad? did it not improve the project? What was even the thing being merged? was it even code?

[edit: I found the commit, the apology should probably include that the file was not beautified before the PR was made..]

Re: I'm sorry

#183

Post by fowl2 »

lostmsu wrote: post #176
EE84M3i wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see "Part of .NET Foundation" anywhere on that page.

It is right under the project name next to the logo.

I also don't see it. Possibly it only shows for people logged in with an account that is associated in some way?

Re: I'm sorry

#184

Post by sprkwd »

armchairhacker wrote: post #99

This whole situation is toxic. She literally made a 1-line change in a configuration file with basically no downsides. She also repeatedly re-opened and then merged the PR despite the other guy telling her to follow the format and wait for a review. Which she shouldn't have done. But then everyone started bashing her and .NET for other (similarly small) things and extrapolating that. Then there's this 1000 legalese w…

> She literally made a 1-line change in a configuration file with basically no downsides.

Yes, but did she get her t-shirt?

Re: I'm sorry

#185

Post by philliphaydon »

dusted wrote: post #182

Such politics and drama... over what? was the merged code bad? did it not improve the project? What was even the thing being merged? was it even code? [edit: I found the commit, the apology should probably include that the file was not beautified before the PR was made..]

That’s only 1 small issue of the bigger issue of projects being pulled into the DNF org with no one’s knowledge.

Re: I'm sorry

#186

Post by sneak »

phkahler wrote: post #134
sillysaurusx wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be right about that. But that doesn’t change the fact that good software now exists, which wouldn’t otherwise exist, and that the software is now open source, which otherwise wouldn’t be open source. In my opinion, that counts for something. I’ve long hoped that gamedev would make a similar transition. And although Unreal Engine et al are open source, it’s still not the default. So in other words, if gamede…

>> can’t shake the feeling that the hard line open source idealism of 1980’s has not achieved all the goals that it set out to achieve... Actually it has done quite well. Not as widespread as some would like, but I think Free Software is doing spectacularly well. I would say nobody needs Microsoft for anything these day because there are great alternative, but they are creating some decent enterprise tools that may n…

There is no replacement for Excel. Those who think there is are either ignorant of Excel's capability, or are fooling themselves.

Re: I'm sorry

#187

Post by sneak »

sillysaurusx wrote: post #101
sneak wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft doesn't contribute to open source software because open source software is good for the world. Microsoft contributes to open source software because Microsoft wants to sell more proprietary software and services to the open source world, as more and more developers live in that world. They realized that without significant service lock-in, people would begin to abandon things like Windows (and continue to i…

You might be right about that. But that doesn’t change the fact that good software now exists, which wouldn’t otherwise exist, and that the software is now open source, which otherwise wouldn’t be open source. In my opinion, that counts for something. I’ve long hoped that gamedev would make a similar transition. And although Unreal Engine et al are open source, it’s still not the default. So in other words, if gamede…

> I’ve long hoped that gamedev would make a similar transition.

Reminder: Microsoft is one of the biggest game platforms, too, and have not even flirted with the idea of open source there.

Re: I'm sorry

#188

Post by dusted »

philliphaydon wrote: post #185
dusted wrote: post #182

Such politics and drama... over what? was the merged code bad? did it not improve the project? What was even the thing being merged? was it even code? [edit: I found the commit, the apology should probably include that the file was not beautified before the PR was made..]

That’s only 1 small issue of the bigger issue of projects being pulled into the DNF org with no one’s knowledge.

That's not the topic of this apology, so it's an entirely inappropriate place to have that discussion. The apology is about not following the procedure..

Re: I'm sorry

#189

Post by lostmsu »

fowl2 wrote: post #183
lostmsu wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is right under the project name next to the logo.

I also don't see it. Possibly it only shows for people logged in with an account that is associated in some way?

You are right. It does not show in private browser mode.

Re: I'm sorry

#190

Post by philliphaydon »

dusted wrote: post #188
philliphaydon wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s only 1 small issue of the bigger issue of projects being pulled into the DNF org with no one’s knowledge.

That's not the topic of this apology, so it's an entirely inappropriate place to have that discussion. The apology is about not following the procedure..

The whole post in the link is in reference to more than just the pushing of a PR.

> It is also clear that the .NET Foundation project governance model is not well understood. Project maintainers sign an agreement that either assigns or contributes their project to the .NET Foundation. That’s the point at which project ownership changes. We’ll post another document on that this week as well.

It's clear reading the comments on HN that the majority of people commenting have no clue what is going on.

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