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Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

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Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#181
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely this is true for all developers, at any size? And also just about any product, or service, in any industry? As counterexamples: Apple sell Logic, yet it has numerous competitors, also all fairly successful: ProTools, Live, Cubase, Reaper, Ardour, FruityLoops. Apple give their customers Notes, Reminders and Mail for free , on all their devices (i.e. you don't even need to get hold of apps for these functions),…

When Apple added Screen Time, they banned other competing apps.

I see how that does affect the competition. Fair point.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#182

Wow. That's amazing. That's a 20% increase in revenue for those eligible. I'm guessing they decided the increased value of their products from more smaller developers creating apps for the platform is greater than the lost revenue. If I understand correctly though, since it's a hard cutoff it creates this gap between 1m and ~1.2m where you're actually worse off by making more money pre-tax. 999k --[-15%]--> 849k 1000…

it's exactly like the freelancer tax brackets in Italy. Everybody jumping through hoops (and or not declaring stuff) to remain under the threshold of 60k/year (was 30k/year). Otherwise tax rate doubles.

Same in Argentina, sadly :-(

I would like if there is any solution to this other than to apply the same percentage to all income.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#183
post #173

I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this: to me it seems to be purely a cynical piece of PR on Apple’s part. They hope to significantly reduce the pressure on politicians to take a close look at their App store practices by significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue. This has nothing to do with “doing the rig…

Apple/Google's 30% take is a tiny baby elephant in the room.

Apple and Google have a model where they make lots MORE money outside the system and if the price of software is ZERO they would be happy.

In Apple's case, even free software sells their phone.

In Google's case, even free software funnels users to their ad platform.

[1] "Smart companies try to commoditize their products’ complements."

1: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/06/12/strategy-letter-v/

(joel's a smart guy, he should write more often)

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#184
post #173

I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this: to me it seems to be purely a cynical piece of PR on Apple’s part. They hope to significantly reduce the pressure on politicians to take a close look at their App store practices by significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue. This has nothing to do with “doing the rig…

Sure, being pro-indie is good PR.

I don't see how this helps with antitrust though. Either way, it is an actual policy. Newsworthy, at least.

Also, a comment isn't necessarily positive or negative. This isn't a poll on Apple's HN approval rating. It's an announcement of a thing Apple is doing.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#185
post #173

I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this: to me it seems to be purely a cynical piece of PR on Apple’s part. They hope to significantly reduce the pressure on politicians to take a close look at their App store practices by significantly reducing the absolute number of developers suffering the full impact whilst taking the minimum possible hit to their revenue. This has nothing to do with “doing the rig…

> I’m seeing a lot of positive comments on HN about this

To me it seems like those comments are in the minority while the popular opinion is the cynical take.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#186
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 30% is a case for antitrust given how big Apple App Store today is. 15% seems reasonable, 10% would be ideal. Not it isn't a case for anti-trust. 70/30 split whether people on here like it or not is a standard agreement for these types of business relationship. https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/10/07/report-steams-30-cut... The judge in the case agreed. > Judge says the 30% rate is the industry rate— references Ste…

It's only standard as Apple was first through the gate with this scheme for online marketplaces. They got to copy the split from brick-and-mortar (without the accompanying costs like restocking) and everyone else followed suit.

Apple was not first through the gate. This fee structure has been in place at least since Nintendo in the 80s.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Huh? They didn't say "standard", they said "reasonable" and "ideal". I should have clarified. They was saying it (the 30%) was a case for antitrust. > The problem is that they charge that fee no matter where the customers come from, and you can't opt out either. Can they come from anywhere other than the actual store? In any event that is a different issue.

> Can they come from anywhere other than the actual store? If I have a link on my site that takes a customer directly to the store page, and they buy it, then Apple did nothing at all to earn an "affiliate" level payout. They didn't drive any traffic. Or if the customer puts in the exact app name and buys it. > In any event that is a different issue. It's very relevant to whether 30% is reasonable. Apple acts as a le…

> If I have a link on my site that takes a customer directly to the store page, and they buy it, then Apple did nothing at all to earn an "affiliate" level payout. They didn't drive any traffic.

The store provides you visibility through promotion on the store page, being listed in search and taking payment for the purchase.

This would be no different than if a boxed piece of software was in a brick and mortar retailer and you told your customers you could by it at those stores.

In a brick and mortar retailer they display your product in your store and people come in, take the box and go to the checkout.

Conceptually the process is exactly the same. The only difference is that it is happening over the internet.

> Or if the customer puts in the exact app name and buys it.

The user is still using the store to buy the app. It would be no different than a boxed piece of software being on display in brick and mortar retailer. The customer may only go in there to pick up the game and nothing else. They are still buying through apple.

> It's very relevant to whether 30% is reasonable. Apple acts as a legitimate affiliate some of the time, but they forcibly take that fee all of the time.

No it isn't. You are conflating the issues of them having absolute control over the app store and whether 30% is reasonable. 30% is reasonable because that is the standard rate in most of these relationships.

If it wasn't reasonable people wouldn't publish with Steam, Gog, Nintendo (nintendo lowered the rate if you look at the IGN link to 30% to match other stores).

Also if it wasn't financially viable with the 30% fee (which has been there since 2011) then people wouldn't publish apps there.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#189

Wow. That's amazing. That's a 20% increase in revenue for those eligible. I'm guessing they decided the increased value of their products from more smaller developers creating apps for the platform is greater than the lost revenue. If I understand correctly though, since it's a hard cutoff it creates this gap between 1m and ~1.2m where you're actually worse off by making more money pre-tax. 999k --[-15%]--> 849k 1000…

As some of these platforms/markets mature, and the policies managing them... running a platform gets similar to running a country. Progressive taxation. Loopholes or anti-loopholes in this case. MSFT basically has an IRS.

Re: Apple Announces App Store Small Business Program

#190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because by suggesting Apple pay developers to make apps and not the other way around you either don't know history, how markets and distribution work, or you're making a joke. You strategy played out very well in pre 2008 days with Windows Mobile. It also played out very well for Microsoft paying developers to create apps for Windows Phone, before Microsoft admitted defeat and left the phone market they were in since…

This is laughable. You can setup Shopify to sell your physical inventory worldwide plus get an invoicing solution that deals with MOSS etc. for fraction of what Apple charges for hosting a file in an app. Plus they don't allow competing app stores, so they can dictate these extortionate prices.

I don't know what an e-commerce platform has to do with a distribution platform.

Just because you can create a store with Shopify, or build a website with Wix, doesn't mean you get access to a marketplace with billion people in it.

There's a reason why sellers want to be on Amazon, even when they have their own Shopify shops.

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