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Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

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Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#181

Post by kaibee »

nickelcitymario wrote: post #122
iN7h33nD wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not cherry pick the worst examples, just the most common. Only one of your examples could possibly lead to a good aspiration in people, charities. Even that seems like a stretch though as many advertisements for charities are scams or to charities that only use a low percentage of the donation for the charities cause. It could push people to look up a list charities and donate, which is why it could be positive…

Alright, clearly we don't have a shared understanding of what is good or bad. That's cool. I understand your position, even if I don't agree with it. > Why do we need to be socialist or a utopia to ban most advertising? You don't, as long as you don't mind a sudden drop in national GDP.

> You don't, as long as you don't mind a sudden drop in national GDP.

GDP is a terrible measure of how economy feels for the median person. A sudden drop in the GDP due to the lower classes saving money as a result of not being constantly bombarded with ads for net-negative goods seems like a win to me. Banning tobacco ads also caused the GDP to drop.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#182

Post by wyldfire »

nickelcitymario wrote: post #35
wpietri wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. This is classic POSIWID: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_purpose_of_a_system_is_wha... People mainly buy things to solve problems, to end negative feelings. So if you want people to buy things, the obvious solution is to create negative feelings that can be ended by spending money on your product. The most obvious example is of course addictive products. Just when we were finally weaning society of nicotin…

Public relations != advertising. Ed Bernays != spokesperson for all PR professionals. There are shady people in every industry.

> Bernays did not smoke cigarettes himself, and persistently tried to induce his wife Doris to quit.[49] After his semi-retirement in the 1960s, he worked with the pro-health anti-smoking lawyer John Banzhaf's group, ASH, and supported other anti-smoking campaigns.[citation needed]

I skimmed the Wikipedia article on Bernays [1] and found this interesting. At first, I think 'Oh hey, he realized his mistake and tried to make amends?' But that "citation needed" is curious. Did he merely tell his wife to stop smoking because he cared about her and knew how dangerous it was, but didn't actually support anti-smoking campaigns? Is the Wikipedia article content itself a product of deceptive PR about Bernays' legacy?

EDIT: that last bit was mostly in jest: the section of the article about his work w/United Fruit Co is not at all positive in hindsight.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#183

Post by interestica »

uoaei wrote: post #164
CamperBob2 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The effect appears to be negative if anything. That article is starkly (and suspiciously) alone in its conclusions, if you look at what's been happening statistically over the last few years. The systems will get better, but for the time being, they mostly serve to let drivers think they can get away with paying even less attention to the road than usual.

This is a "get off my lawn" sort of comment, but: Easy cars are making worse drivers. People rarely check their blind spot now because the little light on their sideview mirror lights up instead. People are less concerned about driving unsafely because their cars are thicker, heavier, and bigger than the other participants on the road. This has been especially troubling to watch develop from the bike lane, as visibil…

Aren't we seeing our first requests from manufacturers to remove sideview mirrors entirely? To be replaced by cameras and video screens.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#184

Post by wickedwiesel »

njharman wrote: post #162
throwawaymath wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That raises profound and fascinating philosophical questions about the nature of knowledge and happiness. I wonder how many of those people would choose to forego the knowledge of what they don't have if it meant they would be happy again. On the other hand, is that even a meaningful question to ask, given it's not possible? Which of course leads to the ethical question: is it right for people to live in ignorance if…

You're missing a key factor. It's not "knowledge of what they don't have" that advertising brings. Advertising is highly sophisticated psychological manipulation, refined over that lat 100 years, that invents "needs" and "wants" in the target subjects. Much of that manipulation is preys upon and creates in securities, inflicts unhappiness and other manufactured "ills". Then promises to relieve them if you buy. It's a…

There is the obvious plug to the Century of Self documentary, if someone hasn't seen it yet but is interested in the subject of "creating needs and wants": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnPmg0R1M04 or https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2d29tf

The documentary relates "The story of the relationship between Sigmund Freud and his American nephew, Edward Bernays. Bernays invented the public relations profession in the 1920s and was the first person to take Freud's ideas to manipulate the masses. He showed American corporations how they could make people want things they didn't need by systematically linking mass-produced goods to their unconscious desires."

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#185

Post by logjammin »

glitchc wrote: post #12
logjammin wrote: post #5

I spent a lot of time in Vermont many years ago. I'd been there a little while, blissfully unaware, before someone told me "yeah, they banned billboards here in the sixties - you didn't notice?" I hadn't consciously noticed, no, but I'd spent my time there until that comment driving around stunned at how beautiful the place was. Now I knew the reason for that (well, partial reason - billboards or not, it's a pretty p…

Whoa, I never realized that. I live north of the border and drive through Vermont every so often to visit family. Now that you mention it, there are zero billboards on the highways.

Hell yeah! Cool to be able to share that eureka moment with others who know the area. Spread the word.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#186

Post by interestica »

logjammin wrote: post #185
glitchc wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whoa, I never realized that. I live north of the border and drive through Vermont every so often to visit family. Now that you mention it, there are zero billboards on the highways.

Hell yeah! Cool to be able to share that eureka moment with others who know the area. Spread the word.

You've made me want to visit Vermont.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#187

Post by nickelcitymario »

kerkeslager wrote: post #171
nickelcitymario wrote: post #28

I'm gonna take the contrarian viewpoint here. Full disclosure: I'm in advertising. The researcher states that increasing "aspiration" (their term) leads to dissatisfaction and more unhappiness. Sure! But aspiration is also why we invented the wheel, harnessed fire, founded fancy schools like Harvard, try to be good parents, etc. I don't disagree that ambition and aspiration can make a person unhappy. But it's also wh…

> Advertising isn't inherently bad, any more than aspirations are inherently bad. It boils down to what's being advertised and how honest the ads are about it. They aren't honest about it. An honest appraisal of a product would include all relevant information, including if a competitor's product is better or cheaper, or if the product has problems that might be worse than the solution. That's what Consumer Reports-t…

> Advertising isn't there to help consumers--it fundamentally is the wrong way to help consumers.

Advertising helps businesses. Businesses serve consumers. Businesses wouldn't spend a dime on advertising if it didn't need to in order to stay in business. Ergo, advertising serves consumers, albeit indirectly.

> They aren't honest about it.

Has any advertiser ever claimed to give you the full picture? Both sides of the argument? No, of course not. It's a sales pitch. You know it's a sales pitch. They know you know it's a sales pitch. They know that you know that they're only presenting the positive sales points. You know that they know that you know.

Where's the dishonesty, exactly?

It's like going on a date and saying "You know, sometimes I don't shave. Or brush my teeth. Or wear a nice outfit. I only did those to make a good impression. There's a really good chance there's someone better for you out there."

Of COURSE advertisers are putting their best foot forward.

Does your resume list every time you were ever late for work? When you signed up for a credit card, did you tell the bank that you were late on rent a few months ago? When you applied for post-secondary, did you tell them about that math tutor you needed to get through trig?

How freakishly up-front do you need the world to be to live up to your standards?

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#188

Post by nickelcitymario »

kaibee wrote: post #181
nickelcitymario wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alright, clearly we don't have a shared understanding of what is good or bad. That's cool. I understand your position, even if I don't agree with it. > Why do we need to be socialist or a utopia to ban most advertising? You don't, as long as you don't mind a sudden drop in national GDP.

> You don't, as long as you don't mind a sudden drop in national GDP. GDP is a terrible measure of how economy feels for the median person. A sudden drop in the GDP due to the lower classes saving money as a result of not being constantly bombarded with ads for net-negative goods seems like a win to me. Banning tobacco ads also caused the GDP to drop.

Ok, so how about "as long as you don't mind another recession"?

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#189

Post by kaibee »

nickelcitymario wrote: post #88
s5fs wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Human aspiration is built-in, we don't need help via advertising to desire more from life. Everyone seems to have adopted fire and the wheel without a marketing campaign, after all. Advertising may not be inherently bad, but given the scope and scale of modern advertising, one has to admit that we've gone too far. Google tells me we see about 5,000 ads per day, do you consider this a good or a bad thing? As a represe…

> do you consider this a good or a bad thing? As a representative of your industry I'm curious to hear your thoughts. I wouldn't presume to speak for my industry, but here are my thoughts and I appreciate being asked the question (as opposed to simply being attacked). 1. 5000 ads seems like too much, but I'm really not sure how we could arrive at what would be considered the right amount. 100? 5? 0? And even if we co…

> 3. Most advertising (there are very few exceptions) fund various types of media. With the exception of state-funded media, advertising is the reason we have TV, radio, newspapers, social media, online news, YouTube, etc. Generally speaking, no one is willing to pay the full cost of the media we all consume. It's paid for by advertising. (You're welcome.) (If anyone brings up Netflix, tell me when exactly they intend to turn a profit and become a sustainable business?)

I would greatly appreciate if advertising stopped funding "news" networks like CNN and Fox News. I think I could live happily in a world where Anderson Cooper isn't making 12 million dollars a year for being a news caster in-between ads for various prescription drugs.

Re: Researchers find inverse correlation between advertising and life satisfaction

#190

Post by aylmao »

xtracto wrote: post #8

This reminds me of an anecdote a friend told me: This friend dedicates his time in going to very rural areas/towns here in Mexico to implement government programs. At some point in the past he got to a town were the cantina had just gotten the only TV in town... apparently people in the town were generally happy, and they had everything they needed... so in their view they were not poor. But once they started watchin…

The more I think about it, the more I'm convinced advertising should be regulated.
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