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What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

theatlantic.com

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Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#181

Post by atdrummond »

Caleb_Smith wrote: post #172

I have been teaching a Python course at my local jail M-F for over a year now, and something we have struggled with is finding potential internships or general employment for our students when they are released. We typically recommend our students to enter the local community college system, but we also have some students that are utterly brilliant and could succeed without a formal education. Does anyone have any in…

Please email me at alex@gatepay.co - would love to work something out if possible.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#182

Post by dang »

traderjane wrote: post #18
jtbayly wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> convince people to either not vote - or to vote against their personal best interests. I’ve seen this on HN several times, and it always cracks me up. The condescension isn't dripping. It’s running in torrents. You think the reason they won’t vote the way you want is because they don’t know what’s good for themselves. You might want to consider an alternate: they don’t want someone like you deciding what’s good for…

Is DaiPlusPlus is forcing things down people's throats? Is DaiPlusPlus' condescension running in torrents? Are you being condescending? If I say that consumers are being tricked by ad companies, am I being condescending? How dare I make judgments on so many people? And when American Christians say that Jesus Christ is the only true way and that Islam is a false path, and that all other ways are false pathways which l…

Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. This comment stands out as particularly bad in this entire off-topic morass.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#183

Post by Braggadocious »

shawndrost wrote: post #150
Braggadocious wrote: post #112

I love how inmates get a better education and more support from tech companies than the adults who live in the bay area. The bay area has the worst income inequality of anywhere in any developed country. Bootcamps are a scam and cost tens of thousands of dollars and yet inmates, people convicted of severe crimes, are treated to free education. From a business standpoint this makes more sense because inmates have no b…

Hi. I was a cofounder at Hack Reactor, an SF-based coding bootcamp that also provided the first set of curriculum and instructors for The Last Mile. I personally taught many bootcamp students in SF as well as inmates in San Quentin. Everything you're saying about bootcamps and the motives of people running programs like The Last Mile is total malarkey FYI.

Yeah your motives are so pure. You're a real WK Kellogg. A real Lewis Terman.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#184

Post by bdcravens »

Braggadocious wrote: post #163
bdcravens wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit unclear on your perspective here. Are you saying teaching inmates is wrong because they've apparently lost their chance at success in life because of their "severe crimes"? Regardless of that perspective, here's a truth: most inmates will be released at some point. As a matter of fact, alot of the inequality you reference is a result of those with criminal backgrounds and the socioeconomic conditions that g…

The entire point of prison is to remove them from society. Why are we spending more resources on prisoners than people who've never commited a crime?

Like it or not, most inmates will be released. Patterns of recidivism are well established. If they reoffend, we will spend more resources on those prisoners. (To say nothing of the costs on society when they do reoffend) It seem reasonable to not want to spend money on someone who has already messed up, but the practical reality is there's a real cost to not making those investments.

Put a different way, this is about those who haven't committed crimes: those affected by future crime, and those who haven't yet committed crime but statistically are likely to (think children of the chronically incarcerated)

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#185

Post by dang »

Braggadocious wrote: post #183
shawndrost wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi. I was a cofounder at Hack Reactor, an SF-based coding bootcamp that also provided the first set of curriculum and instructors for The Last Mile. I personally taught many bootcamp students in SF as well as inmates in San Quentin. Everything you're saying about bootcamps and the motives of people running programs like The Last Mile is total malarkey FYI.

Yeah your motives are so pure. You're a real WK Kellogg. A real Lewis Terman.

We've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines and ignoring our request to stop.

If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#186

Post by rayiner »

faceplanted wrote: post #115
rayiner wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your logical error is assuming that it’s so obvious what “vot[ing] against [one’s] own interests” means. Maybe a stable free market government with a strong cultural and religious framework is in everyone’s interest, and the “massive industry” exists to convince people of that fact?

This was like the archetype of a partisan argument. You two managed to go through why the sides don't like each other's worldview or the way it's expressed, and then stopped the second it came to discussing any real world issues. And I mean both of you as well, you could've given examples and data about why your system might be in anyone's interest but you didn't and it would've been the perfect time for him to reply…

I’m not trying to convince anybody of that world view. My point is more modest: people can reasonably disagree about what is in the “best interest” of various groups, and therefore there is a difference between “convincing people to vote against their best interest” and “convincing people that a particular world view is in their best interest.”

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#187

Post by dang »

ShorsHammer wrote: post #77

> Issues that absolutely nobody thinks much of outside of the country that imprisons more people per capita than Xinjiang

Would you please stop posting flamebait here? We've already had to ask you this.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#188

Post by dang »

jstewartmobile wrote: post #135
GordonS wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd rather not have technically proficient felons near passwords, credit card #s, and other personal information Isn't a felon's debt to society meant to be repaid after their sentence ends? I'd much rather that people leave prison ready to be useful and/or productive members of society.

Trust has to be earned--even for non-felons. After the debt is paid, I think that puts the balance at zero. How many tech firms hire at zero--other than in situations like this limited-time virtue signaling / PR fodder opportunity?

Why do you assume they're not earning trust? The article says: All three apprentices were placed on the test-automation team, which writes tests to ensure the quality of other engineers’ code, precisely because it’s insulated from customer data. The people doing the hiring are aware of the issue, as anyone in their position would be. It is obvious.

Would you mind re-reading the site guidelines and noting this one?

"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#189

Post by TulliusCicero »

dang wrote: post #178
TulliusCicero wrote: post #2

> We need to applaud companies like Slack, but know that the nitty-gritty of human services—housing, health care, social support—which lots of nonprofits and public institutions are working on, the private sector has largely turned away from.” I mean, yeah? Those things sound like they’re precisely the kind of stuff that’s the domain of non-profits and the government. Why would we expect Slack or other tech companies…

Please don't take HN threads on generic ideological tangents. Those blow up into generic ideological flamewars, which are always the same and always less interesting than the specific discussion that they destroy by burning as kindling. With your comment, you provoked a flamewar that degenerated straight to bon mots like " Government is to govern. ", " I’ve seen this on HN several times, and it always cracks me up. T…

With respect, it was directly related to a quote in the article. It wasn't my intent to provoke a flame war; I was addressing what I felt was faulty reasoning used by someone in the article.

I understand where you're coming from, but I'm honestly not sure how much of the article -- or articles in general -- I could bring up without it potentially counting as an 'ideological tangent', as that seems like an awfully broad and ambiguous label. Just about everything is ideological to somebody.

I also don't see what about my comment exactly counts as flamebait. I wasn't overly abrasive, I didn't say anything particularly outrageous or extreme. It was a political sort of point, yes, but "how do we, as a society, help former criminals integrate back into society" is kind of inherently political, I think.

Re: What Happens After Prisoners Learn to Code?

#190

Post by jstewartmobile »

dang wrote: post #188
jstewartmobile wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trust has to be earned--even for non-felons. After the debt is paid, I think that puts the balance at zero. How many tech firms hire at zero--other than in situations like this limited-time virtue signaling / PR fodder opportunity?

Why do you assume they're not earning trust? The article says: All three apprentices were placed on the test-automation team, which writes tests to ensure the quality of other engineers’ code, precisely because it’s insulated from customer data. The people doing the hiring are aware of the issue, as anyone in their position would be. It is obvious. Would you mind re-reading the site guidelines and noting this one? "…

I am so sorry for not accepting and praising this Atlantic-laundered Slack press release.

If my reading comprehension were on-point, I would have clearly understood that this is against site guidelines.

Please delete my account, posts, and comments so that they no longer taint this fine establishment.

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