'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology • Hacker News Board

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#181

Post by Konnstann » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:03 PM UTC

dekhn wrote: post #151

Konnstann wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article you linked draws more of a link between income levels and police violence than it does race. They explicitly say that the crime rates of low-income neighborhoods, populated by majority minority groups, are higher than that of more affluent neighborhoods. Furthermore most of the injuries happen when the person stopped has a gun, regardless of race. Not great, and certainly unacceptable, but not equivalent…

if you want to deny the lived experience of african americans in the US, you're free to do so (it falls under free speech) but frankly I think making ivory tower-level statements like this ignores an extraordinary amount of evidence that african americans (and many non-caucasians) experience systemic racism that affects their economic opportunities and health.

I grew up in a majority non-white area, and am now subsequently living in another majority non-white area. I can count on one hand the number of beat cops I've seen in those cities. Seems to me if there's a higher crime rate, the amount of cops increases, and the likelihood you get stopped increases as well.

On another note, when did Caucasian become a term for white people? As an actual Caucasian, having immigrated to the US from a region near Caucasus, I don't get why people use the term so loosely. The debate is about skin color, just use skin color.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#182

Post by mytailorisrich » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

barry-cotter wrote: post #20

wjoe wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The USA as the only nation in the world with true free speech protections" Is this accurate? Legally, I understand that free speech is protected in the US constitution. I'm sure it's not the only country in the world with free speech laws, but I don't know how the specifics compare. Culturally, the US seems less tolerant of free speech than plenty of other places in the world. Obviously China is orders of magnitude…

>> The USA as the only nation in the world with true free speech protections. > Is this accurate? Legally, I understand that free speech is protected in the US constitution. I'm sure it's not the only country in the world with free speech laws, but I don't know how the specifics compare. There is at least a very good case to be made that the US has by far the strongest free speech guarantee. Commonwealth countries an…

There are quite a few restrictions in the UK. Anything that is considered hate speech, racism, etc. for example.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#183

Post by Konnstann » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

mikestew wrote: post #167

Konnstann wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give me an example of something a non-white, non-middle class person can't say or do in public? Maybe it's my limited world-view, but I can't think of anything specific.

As a white man with upper-middle class money to afford good lawyers, I can tell a cop to piss off when they're out of line and suffer fewer repercussions than others. I might go to jail for the evening (no biggie, I've traveled that road), but come Monday morning me and Ms. Pit Bull Lawyer, Esq. go smooth it over with the judge. If it even gets that far...'cuz, you know, I'm white. This could all be in my head, but b…

Anybody with good enough lawyers can tell a cop to piss off, you might even get the cop on a hate crime if you're non-white. I've got the same amount of anecdotes to suggest the opposite. My dad got pulled over because he didn't stop at a stop sign for the mandatory 3-mississippi in our neighborhood, and no lack of melanin in his skin would have been enough to prevent the ticket.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#184

Post by klyrs » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:12 PM UTC

laheyBro wrote: post #174

mikestew wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is the least oppressed society in history. What is ridiculous is to think that is an argument against the truth of parent's statement.

The parent statement is objectively not truth.

You're attempting to refute an absolute statement with a relative one; "--- are oppressed" / "--- are less oppressed than ever." These two statements are logically consistent.

I question your definition of "objectively" in this situation

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#185

Post by j8014 » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:14 PM UTC

throwaway66920 wrote: post #18

mwyah wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Go to Europe and say the holocaust didn't happen, see what occurs. In fact many countries in Europe have blasphemy laws and they uphold them: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/10/its-not-fr...

Meanwhile in America you are liable for insulting vegetables https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_libel_laws Point is, every country has exceptions, and indexing on irrelevant edge cases isn’t especially useful. America is pretty darn good at free speech. But so is, say, Canada.

That has nothing to do with free speech. If I grow some vegetables and sell them and you come along and start advertising that they are poisonous with 0 evidence you can be sued by me for damages.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#186

Post by azangru » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:15 PM UTC

StaticRedux wrote: post #66

dekhn wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i certainly don't forget. I've been watching Russia and China from a very safe position of privilege in the US for many years. The last time I really worried was when I used to post dumb stuff on usenet in college, but in retrospect, I was never really at risk.

It's not privilege. It's a right the country has fought and died for for over 200 years. It's a principle the country was founded on. "Privilege" has lost all meaning in today's world. It's just a word to throw around to slow how "woke" you are. Calling our rights "privilege" is throwing out the struggle and sacrifice of everyone that fought for those rights. You may have been Lucky to have been born in the US, but n…

> Calling our rights "privilege" is throwing out the struggle and sacrifice of everyone that fought for those rights.

But isn't it the very definition of privilege, when through no effort of your own you get to enjoy the benefits for which others have "fought", "struggled", and "sacrificed"? How is it different from the privilege of being born into a rich (or just functional) family?

> You may have been Lucky to have been born in the US, but not Privileged

It looks like the word "privileged", through all these fights on social media, has got a bad rep :-) How is being privileged different than being lucky?

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#187

Post by decebalus1 » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:17 PM UTC

Meai wrote: post #13

In my opinion this fight is important but futile at the level of individual companies. The USA as the only nation in the world with true free speech protections should make free speech a requirement in their trade negotiations. Even with Europe, we should not get certain tariff improvements until free speech goes into law that deserves the name and is equivalent to the US level of free speech.

> The USA as the only nation in the world with true free speech protections

It's not often that I come across such a fine example of American exceptionalism.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#188

Post by trhway » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:22 PM UTC

jeffdavis wrote: post #176

grievances wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many brave people have fought and died for their countries and rights. Its easy to forget that minorities and “unlucky” people fight too; knowing that you’re safe expressing your points of view is something that many have earned, not all have received. That very much sounds like privilege to me.

There is more to be done to protect, secure, and expand the rights of everyone. But they are still rights. Privileges are things granted to you, often conditionally, by someone else. Using the word often sounds quasi-religious to me: "Thank Privilege for this meal we are about to eat, and our safe home, ...".

>Privileges are things granted to you, often conditionally, by someone else. Using the word often sounds quasi-religious to me: "Thank Privilege for this meal we are about to eat, and our safe home, ...".

most people didn't do anything do get whatever rights they are enjoying - they were just born into these rights while many other people don't have those rights. Pretty much definition of privilege.

> Calling our rights "privilege" is throwing out the struggle and sacrifice of everyone that fought for those rights.

That argument works for the Lords Privileges in England too - the ancestors of those Lords were brutal knights who fought bloodily to become the Lords and to get and enjoy the Privileges themselves and by their descendants.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#189

Post by hasntotherp » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:23 PM UTC

cestith wrote: post #145

Roark66 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think many Chinese citizens are taught from a very young age a carefully crafted ideology that tells them that their country used to be oppressed by the west, that the west despises them and looks down at them because they are Chinese. At the same time they are taught Chinese people couldn't handle the kind of "freedom" that exists in the west because politically the country would fracture and chaos would ensue, al…

To be fair, the Chinese have in fact been treated horribly many times in many places by many other countries including at least the US and Japan.

But hasn’t other people been treated worst? The country of India, the entire continent of Africa, and how about all the Native Americans? Do we need to hold grudges from our grandparents parents? According to that logic, the world forever would be in a mode of revenge seeking.

I always find this argument preposterous as someone ethnically Chinese hearing it from a nationalistic Chinese, 10 years younger, from China full of fervour. What exactly have they experience in life that is so full of hardship? To me, it seems like a convenient excuse to brush away any criticism of their actions. No one can criticise them because of what X and Y did to them 150 years ago. Seems like a cop out to me.

I suspect the Chinese government has something to do with this mentality.

Re: 'We good now China?' South Park creators issue mock apology

#190

Post by chrisjc » Tue, Oct 08, 2019, 4:26 PM UTC

Paul-ish wrote: post #160

parkersweb wrote: post #29

Click the link to watch the episode: https://southpark.cc.com/sitewide/img/messages/geoblock/gb.j... The irony is not lost...

I'm not sure what your point here is?

I think parkersweb is trying to equate regional licensing issues to authoritarian censorship?